Cosmetic Surgery question, which house?

1
I have a question about cosmetic surgery and wonder if I'm right to use the 1st house.

It doesn't feel like it is a 6th hse issue as this is more to do with how she is going to feel about having it done and its more about the querents appearance and is integral to her sense of identity etc. rather than illness-6th or the surgeon's competence 10th. Any thoughts?


She had already decided to go ahead and planning the surgery to have a facial feature improved with a little smoothing of wrinkles at the same time.
She is now being persuaded to go for a full face lift but is worried about the extra cost and if it would be worth it (would she like it) or should she stick with her original plan.

So the question is "will I go for the full face lift?"

I've never had used the 1st as the quesited before so any suggestions appreciated.

thanks
"He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes; he who does not ask a question remains a fool forever."
Chinese proverb

www.astrologyreadings.eu

2
Cosmic surgery is not performed for health reasons or to cure an affliction; so it's purely a matter of appearance. That's a first house issue, so you want to see the 1st house and its ruler looking good, and you would also want the Moon in a good shape since the Moon has natural signification over the physical body. Since this is about 'beautifying' having a dignified (or at least unafflicted) Venus in a good aspect to Moon or 1st ruler, or well placed in an angle, would also be ideal.

For concerns about finances, the 2nd house is significant. Generally you want this chart to be free of affliction or 6th house connections - which would indicate that the surgery could lead to health concerns.

Good luck with this chart,
Deb

3
Image


Here is the chart.

Thanks for that confirmation Deb, I've cast the chart and and here are my first thoughts.....


L1 Merc is retrograde, in cap in 8th and lacking essential dignity. Its within a degree of of turning direct. That gives some improvement but not enough to give any positive help.

Merc L1 is ruled by saturn (age) exalts mars (the benefits of the surgeons skills) venus in trip and terms (enjoys looking good) Moon in detriment (not happy with the body)

Moon, natural sig of the body, co ruler of the querent and L2 (the money concerns)
Moon is in 8th lacks dignity and is in its own detriment.

Just on that alone I think I would advise her to hold back from having more work done than she originally planned. I cant see anything to support it.

She is concerned about the expense L2 in 8th. Maybe she needs to borrow money to fund the work.

Moon in cap in 8th as sig of the body, her fear of age/death makes her consider the complete face job?

Merc, Moon and Venus are ruled by Saturn. He is lord of 8th, 9th, 10th, and 11th hse.

Any suggestions about such strong Saturn?

I think worries about age and failing beauty are strong themes with Saturn strong and Venus being combust. She just came out of being cazimi. She makes no aspect to L1.

Venus sig of beauty is also Saturn ruled. Saturn is well dignified in Libra and in 5th hse.

I'll spend a bit more time on it and give some more thoughts later.
Meanwhile I'm interested in any other thoughts

thanks
"He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes; he who does not ask a question remains a fool forever."
Chinese proverb

www.astrologyreadings.eu

4
Hello kakabel

One thing about Saturn at the moment is that it's stationary retrograde.

Interesting that she's wanting to turn back the clock/Chronos, and signified by Mercury emerging from retro and almost all the planets disposited by Saturn going retro.

Regards

H.

6
Wow, what an appropriate moment to ask the question! Stopping the clock and turning it back!

I'm wondering if you use Neptune? I do in horary charts when it's placed somewhere like it is in this one, right on the MC. You said that the querent didn't at first want a full face lift, the idea has come from someone else and you used the word 'persuaded'. High hopes, Neptune and Jupiter together and angular.... I'm not liking what that's signifying, it's a bit exaggerated..... and I'd want the surgeon to have a steady hand but doubt Neptune signifies that!

8
Not really wild about that Moon/Saturn square upcoming, either. Having your 2 ruler in 8 squaring your 8 ruler with no reception gives me some concern for both health and finances.

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ack, sorry, not good with reading these type of chart wheels and lacking sleep lately.......... pls ignore previous mentions of MC! Neptune is of course in the 11th...... still relevant to hopes/wishes though perhaps?

10
Relative to the above chart in response to the specific horary question:
+Part of Fortune (significator of the mind+body+spirit unity of the individual as a whole) is posited in Taurus (sign relation to neck, some say to the lower part of the face), disposited by "beauty" significator, Venus, which planet is direct, elevated (9th house) and within 7 minutes of Cazimi (technically this is not Cazimi but it is so close-7 minutes-that I would consider it Cazimi and therefore highly benefic to the Venus condition)
+Part of Operations (Asc+Sun-Jupiter) = 0Taurus48, thus sign-conjunct Part of Fortune and disposited, like POF, by Venus=Part of Operations Significator (these connections add up to a benefic interpretation of the Part of Operations testimony) Further, the Part of Operations is conjunct Mirach, a co-operative, constructive star of the nature of Venus (Ptolemy), giving influences of "...beneficence and personal beauty "(Robson)
+Part of Beauty (Asc+Sun-Venus) = 6Gemini, the exact degree of the Ascendant; this = significantly benefic testimony.

It is important to remember that these testimonies are in response to the specific horary question only. The election of the most beneficial TIME for the operation is of primary importance.

11
Olivia wrote
Not really wild about that Moon/Saturn square upcoming, either. Having your 2 ruler in 8 squaring your 8 ruler with no reception gives me some concern for both health and finances.
I agree, that makes me feel negative about the answer to the original question. Combined with L1 retro, looking back to the past, merc is a youthful planet. I cant find the positive indicators for me to say "go ahead with the full face job".

I'm interested dr.farr in what you say about venus
"beauty" significator, Venus, which planet is direct, elevated (9th house) and within 7 minutes of Cazimi (technically this is not Cazimi but it is so close-7 minutes-that I would consider it Cazimi and therefore highly benefic to the Venus condition)
I would have considered Venus combust and therefore debilitated, even though only minutes out of cazimi.
How do others deal with it when its so close? Combust has a very different tone to cazimi and could strongly influence the result of this chart. Is 17' the absolute rule of cazimi as I thought, or is it flexible?
"He who asks a question is a fool for five minutes; he who does not ask a question remains a fool forever."
Chinese proverb

www.astrologyreadings.eu

12
The majority of astrologers consider 17 minutes the absolute limit of cazimi; a minority of astrologers consider cazimi to equal 30 minutes of perfect conjunction; I do not fully ascribe to either opinion as constituting an ironclad "rule". I have studied several charts with placements at 18, 25, 26 minutes which( seemingly) demonstrated cazimi enhancement of the benefic "effects" of the planet involved; personally, when I'm not sure if cazimi might apply to positions just out of 17 minutes I convert the chart from LMT to sundial time (LAT) and see if the planet goes into the 17 degree range or at least moves closer to it (if it moves closer to the 17 minute border I regard this as a demonstrating a "cazimi trend" and consider the planet in cazimi) In the current chart, however, no time/location for when the question was asked has been posted.

+My delineation of this chart concerned the health/healing/emotional elements only. Relative to financial ramifications, the devil is in the 2nd house (Dragon's Tail in 2nd); a very negative testimony re to the money/financial aspect of this horary; Dragon's Tail is also within a couple degrees of perfect opposition to the Sun (health, vitality)/Venus (operation and beauty significator) combination, indicating the likelihood of negative money/financial ramifications upon the health/beauty testimonies. Not the first time that Mammon has blocked Apollo and Aphrodite!