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Financial Horary

 
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1147

Posted: Mon Apr 12, 2021 10:20 pm    Post subject: Financial Horary Reply with quote

Hello,

I have a big tax bill this year and I think the amount owed is unfair. I am planning on challenging it and offering a lesser amount. I did not qualify for any relief checks either, and live in the most expensive area of the country, so this feels extra unfair to me. I wanted to see if it would be a waste of time and energy to do so or if it might lead to something, so I asked, "will they accept my offer of a lesser amount?"



My significator is strong: Sun in Joy in a sign of its exaltation and in a day chart (sect). I am unsure of the emphasis on the 9th but I am often in that house. It is the house of seeking guidance from astrology so that could be its significance. It could also show that I am approaching this with a good argument. I have been known to be very good at argumentation and even had perfect GRE argumentation scores, which only 0.01% percent of grad school test takers achieve.

Moon is also in the early sign of Taurus, a sign of its exaltation but it is an early degree and less stable, also aspecting Uranus. There may be something unforseen approaching regarding my financial situation, I wonder. It is increasing in light, which is good when you want to see a benefit of something, although if you want to decrease debt I would wonder if a waning Moon might be more auspicious. In general, the Moon is considered better when increasing in light. It is out of sect and leaving the beams though. Also, it is applying to square Saturn, 7th lord (tax collector). Not good.

Mercury, sig of my finances or offer is besieged between Saturn, 7th lord and Mars, 9th and 4th lord (my dispositor too). I checked the aspect and it does aspect Mars before Sun or Jupiter. The 7th lord could be the tax collector or person who would receive my offer. I think Mars might relate to my home purchase and the costs associated with my house, since it lords the 4th and is part of my argument on the amount I am offering. Sun is also applying to and received by Mars, so I wonder if it is stating my argument is valid.

The 8th lord of the tax debt is in the 7th house of the tax collector. Jupiter shows the sum is large and the 7th house lord controls the sum. Sun eventually applies to Jupiter and is received and Jupiter in the house of the tax collector does seem to show them as less severe than just a Saturn sig but overall I am not seeing them as super accomidating even though my approach seems valid and strong.

I think given the strength of my sigs and the PoF in the 1st, I may give it a shot and hope for the best but it seems like it might be very difficult if not impossible, given the 2nd lord is besieged and combust and the 7th lord is a planet that is not known to be flexible and also does not receive my significators. However, they are also dignified and Saturn cadent is less severe as well. A weak 2nd lord might suggest to the tax collector that my finances show I deserve a break. One negative too is that the angles are fixed and the 7th lord is fixed, showing less flexibility. There are some mixed indicators.

I will update later if this goes anywhere. I haven't prepared anything yet but doing it during an Aries Sun is probably a good idea considering I am a strong Mars in Aries and also have other fire planets that trine Sun right now. I did do an online form that predicts if you can offer less and it did show I could qualify to save a little.
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AmeliaS



Joined: 07 Apr 2020
Posts: 256

Posted: Tue Apr 13, 2021 1:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree this square between Moon and Saturn is not a good sign. If the fortunate Moon manages to get something from this Saturn, at least I wouldn't expect the process to be pleasant or any concession to be massive.

But I do think some concessions are possible. All significators behold the ascendant. The angular benefic in the 7th is friendly with your Sun. Your sun is received by Mars into the 11th. Your finances Mercury is applying to both its domicile lord and exaltation lord. Though Mercury is stuck between Saturn and Mars, those aspects have been easy. This Mercury rules both the 2nd and another good house, the 11th, which I believe has something to do with government's benefits (see a recent chart I quote below).

If we treat this as a case of dual rulership (2nd and 11th by Mercury), Bonatti would say Mercury applying to both Sun and Mars supports perfection.

Saturn, though in a fixed sign, is in a sign that is humane and dignified, so I imagine this Saturn is at least willing to reason. Sympathy, not so much, but at least you can trust it to play by the book, which you know is on your side. Saturn rules 6 & 7, and it is in the 6th not the 7th, so I wonder if he signifies some upcoming procedures and paperwork that's gonna bother you.

I did a similar chart in February asking if I would be able to collect some government's benefits they owed us. This is the chart.

https://imgur.com/s6rtnXO

My chart was maybe slightly prettier, but wasn't so massively positive, either. My Taurus Moon (for some reason I'm often Taurus Moon) from the 11th squared an Aqua Jupiter in the 8th. The benefic was dignified, but it was under the beams and it didn't receive my Moon. What followed was a bit of tedious research and back and forth and some worries.

Next, Moon squared a Venus ruling a sign intercepted in the 11th. This was with reception by domicile. Venus was combust by a Sun leaving his current sign. The money came through 5-6 weeks later. The ugly conjunction with Mars that followed did not seem to influence the outcome so much. The combustion may have to do with my having no direct access to the money as of this moment.

Good luck!

Amelia
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Ouranos



Joined: 28 Mar 2020
Posts: 516

Posted: Tue Apr 13, 2021 2:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Tanit,

Notwithstanding a deeper analysis, you asked 'Will they accept my offer of a lesser amount?"
It seems a clear Yes as MercuryL2 is applying by sextile to JupiterL8 in 7th. Your money, by direction, goes to the IRS.

Looking at mitigating factors.
- MercuryL2 is Oriental and Combust and the Moon is under the sunbeams. So it seems you do not have a full picture of all the arguments in your favor. I would seek a professional advice, from a lawyer or your accountant (Moon in the 9th). But you will have to push and dig for clearer answers (Moon is slow, New and cadent). You will act more in reaction to circumstances.
- On a side note, Mars being a positive factor in the 11th of Good Fortune, seek advice of friends, Or deductions from your professional endeavours (2nd from 10th), like research projects you may have been engaged or deductions for scientific research, which may have been raised during the pandemic. Lilly noted that if the querent has a secret wish but is unwilling to explain what it is, the condition of this house will show whether or not they are likely to receive what they desire..
- Moon's last aspect is a trine to Pluto (natural ruler of taxes)which turns retrograde on April 28th. Delays. Expectations are still good. But it is not as good as it should have been, or as good as was anticipated. Go for it!

Best to you,
Ouranos
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1147

Posted: Tue Apr 13, 2021 5:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ouranos - it is interesting you mentioned I might be missing something. One of my sisters said the same but I went through the numbers with her and she saw it and said she agreed. I went through everything many times. I researched a lot and am not seeing any loopholes but you are right that if wouldn't hurt that much financially to consult a professional. They can also help with the process to ask to pay a lesser amount.

I do see Mercury hitting Mars first, prohibiting Jupiter but Jupiter also is kind of collecting light really, since it aspects Mars too (and will be aspected by Sun too).

Amelia - I agree that Saturn is not one for sympathy and I definitely had planned on a logical approach (that is usually my approach anyway).

Thanks for the feedback, you guys.
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Wisdom Joy



Joined: 12 Aug 2020
Posts: 154

Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi team,

Firstly Tanit, I hope that it works out for you and you can at least negotiate a smaller payback. I have a small question about the chart, isn't the moon considered VOC and doesn't that impact the outcome of success?
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1147

Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
isn't the moon considered VOC and doesn't that impact the outcome of success?


I guess that would depend on your definition of what a VOC Moon is. The astrologers I follow would say the Moon is not aspecting anything within its current sign. It would aspect Saturn and Jupiter while in Tarurus. Additionally, it would depend on how you define orbs. I use the 10 degree and 30 seconds rule between Moon and Saturn, where the aspect is 10 degrees 18 seconds here, within orb.

https://www.skyscript.co.uk/voc.html

https://www.skyscript.co.uk/aspects.html

Also, I am a natal Moon-Saturn square with Saturn lording the 7th, and it is not uncommon for me to encounter it in horary as an emphasized aspect. It would describe difficulties with others or that the querent believes other people do not help them or will not help them. In my case I agree that aspect makes sense because my assumption tends to be negative when I ask for something from others. When you have this aspect you often end up giving more than receiving. In a financial horary I could see this being literal with money. It could mean I might get a conservative amount back at most but I would feel I pay much more than I get back.
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Wisdom Joy



Joined: 12 Aug 2020
Posts: 154

Posted: Thu Apr 15, 2021 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you so much for this additional information it's very helpful. I actually have a similar chart with the moon as co-sig and the Saturn square, and the querent also very much felt like the same around not receiving any help.

I'll definitely be mindful of this going forward.

Thanks, Tanit.
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1147

Posted: Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Update: I decided to have the return checked by a tax pro and so far they have not been helpful with anything. So far it seems I did everything correct. I rechecked everything yesterday before sending it to the pro and noticed a minor error that made a difference of a few hundred dollars.
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Wisdom Joy



Joined: 12 Aug 2020
Posts: 154

Posted: Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you think this few hundred is the adjustment listed above? I guess you won't know until you find out the final answer maybe.
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1147

Posted: Tue May 11, 2021 6:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Possibly. The tax pro did end up saving me another hundred or so.

I am not able to send in the request to lower the price until after I make my first payment, which they scheduled for mid June. I will post an update when I hear more but I am not expecting much. If I save a few thousand it would be worth the effort though.
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
Posts: 1147

Posted: Fri Jul 09, 2021 8:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Final update: I decided not to submit an offer once I read through the fine print that they put a lien on your record and it can take up to two years to process (I could pay it off before then anyway). I am guessing that might be the signification of Mars the 4th lord here- I don't want a lien on my property.

I got a very tiny check back for my state return so far, so with that and the money the tax specialist got back to me, that might be the very conservative amount some of us saw.
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Ouranos



Joined: 28 Mar 2020
Posts: 516

Posted: Sat Jul 10, 2021 12:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for the update Tanit,
As you pointed out, Mars L4 played a significant role in the outcome.
Which also signifies the 'end of the matter'

Take care,
Ouranos
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