digbala

1
i have been thinking about digbala... here is an article that is a pretty good overview on it

https://blog.astrologylover.com/directi ... y-digbala/

dig essentially means direction.. so the strength a planet can receive is based on the direction the planet is found in the chart...

my problem with this is no consideration is given for other issues like whether the chart is nocturnal or diurnal... it doesn't factot into digbala... another problem i have with digbala is there is no rationale explained for why these planets get greater strength in a particular direction... in all theories or basic script in astrology this is a common feature... one is told a planet rules a particular sign, but the rationale has to be figured out intuitively by the curious person, or one is left just accepting astro dogma... as i am not willing to accept astro dogma, i am trying to understand why a particular planet would receive this greater strength via it's particular direction.... if anyone has any thoughts - feel free to express them...

digbala is an important ingredient to the greater issue of shadbala..

Planets Directional Strength
Sun and Mars 10th House
Jupiter & Mercury Ascendant
Saturn 7th House
Venus and Moon 4th House

i have read nothing on what happens when the planet gets greater strength by being in a particular direction, but is in a sign that it has affinity with or not... no mention either if one thinks that a nighttime or daytime birth would alter these views either.. one is left to surmise on so much of astrology and it is not completely clear to me how these viewpoints were arrived at.. thoughts welcome..

2
Hello James,

Interesting article and questioning.
I have read in Vedic Astro Textbook by Narasimha Rao where he says, besides the directions you give for the planets, "3.2.15 Moon, Mars and Saturn are strong in the night time. Sun, Jupiter and Venus are strong in the daytime. Mercury is always strong.
Natural malefics are strong in Krishna paksha (From Full Moon to New Moon).
Natural benefics are strong in Sukla paksha. (From New Moon to Full Moon)

So from the above, my guess is that it is based on the motion of the Sun around the ecliptic and its dance with the Moon.

He is also talking about trines in 7.4.1 reinforcing the digbalas.

Fire Trines Dharma is shown by the trines from the 1st house – 1st, 5th and 9th – and they show prosperity of self, intelligence and dharma. (Dharma literally means duty. However, it has come to mean righteousness.) They are called “dharma trikonas??? (trines of duty). The character of a person, his intelligence and his righteousness decide how one follows dharma – the first purpose of human existence.

Trines from the 2nd house are called “artha trikonas??? (trines of money) and they show money related activities. The 2nd house shows wealth. The 6th house shows service. The 10th house shows career and activities in society. These three houses show money related activities and how one follows artha – the second purpose of human existence.

Trines from the 3rd house are called “kaama trikonas??? (trines of desire) and they show one’s desires and how one gets them. The 3rd house shows one’s persistence. The 7th house shows relations and sex. The 11th house shows gains. These three houses show how one follows kaama – the third purpose of human existence.

Trines from the 4th house (4th – harmony, 8th – occult studies and spiritual awakening and 12th – moksha) are called “moksha trikonas??? (trines of liberation) and they show how one follows moksha – the fourth purpose of human existence. Digbala of planets who attain full digbala in various of these trines shows the strength of different purushaarthas in one’s life. Dasas like “Trikona Dasa??? which are based on trines show how one follows the four purushaarthas in life.
Planets in trines make each other prosper.

Source: https://www.pdfdrive.com/vedic-astrolog ... 38414.html

Best wishes for 2021!
Ouranos
Blessings!

3
thanks ouranos and hello! and best wishes in 2021 for you!

i have narasimba raos book that you refer to.. i have read some of it.. the part on planets that are stronger in nighttime or daytime is another type of bala as i understand it.. bala means strength as i recall... there are many different ways of accessing strength... shadbala is about the whole spectrum of options for doing this.. i have a book on this too! written by s.k. duggal and neeraja taneja...i am just scanning it now and unable to find any reference to what you mention directly... maybe i need to go grab the rao book! there is tribhaaga bala which is based on hourly strength with the day and night broken up into 6 different parts - 3 for day and 3 for night..

unfortunately most of these indian astro texts to not give an index at the back of the book..

my friend gave me some insights into digbala... aside from direction, it seems that the element or tattava of the planets are integrated into this.... i am going to quote from an e mail i got last night from aj...

"Dig Bala or Directional Strength is intrinsically tied to the tattvas or the 5 elements and each element is associated with a direction, a time for each of the NavaGrahas (9 planets). For reference these are:
Sun, Mars and Ketu are tejas or fire.

Moon and Venus are jala or water
Mercury is prithvi or earth.

Jupiter is akash or ether/space.

Saturn and Rahu are vayu or air.



Directional strength is astrological symbolism at its most basic. The horoscope or chart reflects the diurnal motion of the earth in local space at a particular place and time that links us to the Cosmos.



Each Kendra or angle of a chart is then related to a time, direction and a tattva. The four material tattvas are tejas, prithvi, vayu and jala and each is associated with one of the Kendras or angles in a chart based upon which direction they are the strongest and this is called Dig Bala or directional influence.



The 1st house or rising point is sunrise (6am) and East/Prithvi & Akash, the descendant or 7th house sunset (6pm) and West/Vayu, the 4th house is midnight (12am) and North/Jala, the 10th house is noon (12pm) South/Tejo. Tejo can also be thought of as ‘light’ as well as heat etc.

Akash or ether is strong in the 1st house or east because it begets the other tattvas and prithvi is a combination of all of the other tattvas. All things contain and are contained by the primordial Akash or Space.

Note that the sets can be paired in opposites. Tejas (fire) and jala (water), 4th house/10th house.

Prithvi (earth) and vayu (air), 1st house/7th house."

and"...think of the polarities. Everything must balance yin/yang, earth/air, fire/water."

at which point i mentioned this -
"what are the mulatrikona signs for the individual planets

jupiter - sag, not pisces?

saturn - aquarius, not cap

mars - aries, not scorpio

venus??

mercury - virgo not gemini??

aj response
"Sun-Leo

Moon-Cancer

Mars-Aries

Mercury-Virgo

Jupiter-Sagittarius

Venus-Libra

Saturn-Aquarius

Rahu and Ketu have various MT designations, some think they have none, others have there opinions.

james response
"it seems this fits with the digbala concept, except venus is air - western hemisphere... why is it associated with 4th house - water area??

how does indian astrology account for mars rulering scorpio, jupiter pisces, venus taurus and mercury gemini??

it would also partly explain the friendship concepts of planets in indian astrology - sun, mars and jupiter - all fire.. venus and saturn - air.. air and fire seem to work well together though, so when i look at this with the element concept - i also rule into having to make different bridges to build! now is mercury is air - it fits with venus and saturn... moon is a lonely body here as only one in water... mercury ditto in earth..

maybe this is some help in getting to a closer understanding of digbala... if aj has a response, i will let you know... aj is a generous person and good teacher for me!

5
thanks martin!

if anyone wants to look at what martins link says about digbala it starts on the bottom of page 33 to bottom of page 35... at the top of page 36 is the quote from ouranos post -
(from in the Narasimha Rao book which is where rao got it) -"Moon, Mars and Saturn are strong in the night time. Sun, Jupiter and Venus are strong in the daytime. Mercury is always strong."

if you are using the pdf page numbers it is 48-50...

again - it says it in a book, but the rationale for it, is not laid out... oh well...

i think this was part of my motivation for writing my post on ''what if any are the connections between hellenistic astrology and indian astrology?" or whatever the title of that thread was! i feel like i am in the church of indian astrology and have to accept everything on faith!!!

6
Even in the Greek tradition, the authors who present rationales for some of the doctrines (1) typically belong to later periods than the doctrines they are explicating, and (2) do not always agree with one another. So yes, it is a bit like religion, but that's not a situation unique to India.

Speaking as a historian, I think the Indian 'time strength' (k??labala) that you allude to is a distorted echo of the sect doctrine. (As your friend AJ pointed out, the original grouping is actually present in the Yavanaj??taka.) This is not an uncommon occurrence. Outside India, one example would be Sahl ibn Bishr, who in his introduction to astrology manages to conflate three different groupings of the planets (based on gender, sect, and inferior/superior status). This leads to the astronomically impossible idea of Mars making a heliacal rising in the west, but the text was still passed down and eventually translated both into Latin and (in abbreviated form) Sanskrit.

Assuming that there was a rationale to begin with, it would thus seem useful first to establish the original (or at least earliest preserved) form of the ideas under investigation -- though I suppose rationales invented to defend misunderstandings may sometimes be illuminating in their own way as well.
https://astrology.martingansten.com/

7
Thank you Martin for the link and useful comments. Thank you also James for the complement of information.
Sometimes I wonder if the astrology practiced today is not like a puzzle of Astrocartography. We get a zest of emotion under the line of Western astrology and a pinch of prajna with the line of Indian astrology. We just need to adjust our lenses.
Digbala as I understand it is just another way to assess the strength or debility of a planet and we all have in our charts planets in rulership in one system and debilitated in the other one. Choosing between a Mars in Taurus or Aries! Urgh!... My personal appreciation of it and not scientific at all, I would say Sidereal 1 Tropical 0 (or at least what we have imported today from Hellenistic and tagged Tropical). Which is to say that Hellenistic is very conceivable with the lens of Indian astrology!
I had this wonderful spiritual experience in India a long time ago where I became 'conscious' or 'awaken' during my sleep. And at that point, day and night were the same continuous life. To rephrase it, there were no more debilities and dignities, simply 'consciousness'. Which is another way to merge the opposing forces within ourselves!

Blessings,
Ouranos
Blessings!

8
thanks for your additional insights martin....i think of mistakes as the mother of invention! frank zappa called his band the mothers of invention which is not exactly the same thing! but sometimes one thing leads to the next and you are right... none of this has anything to do with any particular system as they are all privy to it...thanks for the examples... mars making a heliacal rising in the west - i would like to see that!

ouranos - thanks for your personal story from india! i like what you got from all of that too..that sounds like the universal light that you tapped into... if you can give me the phone number for that, i would be most appreciative!

i am foolish enough to think that both tropical and sidereal have merit... i see them as 2 different systems of reference... the view i get looking west is different then the one i get looking east... maybe that is a poor analogy, but it is like this to me... they are complete unto themselves... i read recently where robert zoeller said much the same thing... they both work...

it is indeed interesting how a planet in one zodiac looks different in the other one... mars in aries can become mars in pisces, or venus in scorpio can become venus in libra.. at the same time venus in libra can become venus in virgo too and etc. etc... it forces one to think more deeply on all of this.. i think that is ultimately a good thing...

9
Yes, I am too inclined to believe that both sidereal and tropical have merit.
The dignities of the sidereal zodiac with the exaltation and debilitations is very powerful imo.

But the psychological descriptions of the tropical statements are often quite spot on. I am certainly seeing a lot of my tropical gemini moon in terms of having multiple task going on. Always 10 books going on at the same time loving the feeling of taking in information as a way of feeling good and secure.

But same moon is exalted in sidereal taurus in 10th house dominating the chart in that way. Which fits soo well.

Recent example blew my mind just the other day of the strength of Sidereal exaltations, in the swedish famous painter of nature motives. Bruno Liljefors.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bruno_Liljefors (No TOB).

as a worldclass landscape and nature painter, the venus position is interesting, as his venus is super high declination OOB. And in strength in the divisional charts navamsha, drekkana.

BUT, the interesting thing imo is his natal Mars. Sidereally exalted in his chart capricorn.
Mars is exalted in the normal chart
Exalted also in navamsha
exalted in drekkana chart (used also for strength).

And then I read this in wikipedia...
Image
Last edited by Stefan on Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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I suppose sidereal/tropical comparisons fall within the scope of this forum, but it might be more useful to compare charts with well-documented birth times, and to formulate some clear ideas beforehand regarding what sort of astrological indications one would expect to show up in, e.g., the chart of an artitst and/or an athlete. Surely an athlete (who is not also an artist) and an artist (who is not also an athlete) could be born on the same day and thus share most or all of their sign placements and aspects?

Personally I find the idea that we need not just one but two (or multiple?) zodiacs to get a full picture of a nativity both unattractive and implausible, not to mention daunting when it comes to actual predictive work. The more factors we throw into a chart, the more circumstances of the native's life can be justified, but only in retrospect.
https://astrology.martingansten.com/

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Martin Gansten wrote:
Personally I find the idea that we need not just one but two (or multiple?) zodiacs to get a full picture of a nativity both unattractive and implausible, not to mention daunting when it comes to actual predictive work.
The idea that we need two zodiacs for a full picture of a nativity is unnecessary because very few astrologers are seeing the reality of what we have come to see as the traits of the twelve signs. There are not two sets of sign influences linked to one ecliptic, but only one set of influences.

This means that (for example) sidereal Libra is like tropical Scorpio because they are located in the same degrees of the ecliptic. The western Jyotish astrolgoers have taken us far off track in copying tropical traits to sidereal signs of the same name. Especially the four so-called sign elements are out of whack, totally inaccurate in the sidereal zodiac. (I have been singing this song since the 1980s and especially the 1990s when American astrologers re-named India's astrology as 'Vedic.')

Considering the dignities, exhalations and fall of planets in both zodiacs as valid is totally illogical, but few astrologers seem to have thought this contradiction through.

Martin, do you still have the zodiac paper I sent you last year? You were no doubt working on your books, and likely didn't have time to read the paper.

Stefan, is is possible to shrink your graphic so there isn't so much screen distortion?
Last edited by Therese Hamilton on Mon Dec 28, 2020 8:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
http://www.snowcrest.net/sunrise/LostZodiac.htm