Athletic Event Prediction

1
Hello All. Trying my hand at something different. I am trying to predict the outcome of an athletic event. Essentially my daughter is competing in her states track championships and I asked will XXX win the state meet.

As I am studing. I am learning it is basically a L1 vs L7 question. L1 is XXX since it is my daughter and L7 is the rest of the competition (the field).

So L1 is moon on the 12th cusp by 0.16 degrees and L7 is Saturn in the 7th, and retrograde.

First thought is that since L7 is in her on house the answer is Someone from the field wins. However, we are talking about a retrograde Saturn, so I would read it that allthough Saturn is in her own house, maybe her house is burning down and she can't compete.

Also, POF and North node is in the first house suggesting a favorable out come for XXX.

Comments?

3
Hi Rookie - this is maybe more so a Sports and Speculation topic. They predict which team will win when there is a competition using election for the time and place of the event. I can move this to that thread if you want.

From what I understand, some say it is a little more complicated than L1 and L7 and L1 being the home team. I have tried using this approach for sports competitions and it seems to work most of the time but there are other methods that you might find in that forum. Usually when I look at a chart and someone says they used this approach and it gave the wrong outcome, I don't agree with the planet they say has the most strength, though. They often do not look at traditional signification of planets, such as superiors generally being stronger than inferiors in nature. For example, if a planet is signified by Mars and the opposing team is Venus, Mars by nature is good at athletics and is more superior, and to me seems like it needs to be pretty debilitated to be beat by Venus (just my opinion though). Saturn would definitely be significantly stronger in nature than the Moon, all things being equal. In this case it is already accidentally and essentially stronger too.

The question is, who is Moon and who is Saturn? Some say you have to assign planets based on which one fits the team best, such as looking at color indicators, for example. Another thing some people consider is comparing natal charts for competitors (in cases where it is one on one) or the chart of the team, if available, to the event chart. This can be helpful when used in combo with the predictive techniques. I have never read any books on the subject matter but there are various techniques available for people serious about sports and speculation. Unfortunately, even though I have 5 planets in fire signs and Mars in Aries angular, I like competition but hate sports so I don't have a ton to contribute.

4
Hi tanith

I wrote in my post "So L1 is moon on the 12th cusp by 0.16 degrees and L7 is Saturn in the 7th, and retrograde."

The reason I took L1 as my daughter is because I have a vested interest in her and of course L7 would be the opposition.

L7 in the 7th is favorable for the opponents but POF and NN in the first is good signs for L1. Saturn retrograde and conduct SN is bad. I think the retrograde describes something about the opponents, maybe they appear to be moving backwards compared to my daughter.

Non the less, I would appreciate any and all interpretations.

5
The typical approach is that the home team is represented by L1 and opposing team is L7. Some people give the home team L7, which doesn't make sense to me but is another approach. If it were a horary, I could understand using the 1st for someone specifically, though.

It sounds like PoF is afflicted by Saturn, so not necessarily good. Saturn conjunct SN is considered favorable because it renders it more positive in nature.

6
In most contest charts, the first and tenth houses should be assigned to the favourite whether they are the home team or not, the 7th and 4th houses for the underdog. Pay no attention to colours. They're of such minor testimony in event charts that they are hardly worth considering.

I've found this approach to work in team events such as football, athletics though, is an individual's contest, so I would suggest that a horary such as a "will my daughter win" type of question would probably yield more accurate results.

In such charts, aspects from the Moon to Fortuna really play an important part, as do L1/L10 aspects to the 10th cusp.

7
So far none of this addresses my question. Is a retrograde Saturn L7 in the 7th house of the opponents weak enough to suggest they can't win?

Also another question I came up with reading Wasp mk2's response is should I be turning the chart since the question about my daughter? Should L7 represent my daughter and L1 the opponents?

I guess we will have to wait and see. The event is tomorrow....

8
So far none of this addresses my question. Is a retrograde Saturn L7 in the 7th house of the opponents weak enough to suggest they can't win?
It would help to see a chart to say which planet is stronger because I am just going off of what you said. In my opinion, Saturn is significantly stronger but I have no idea who is Saturn, if anyone. I would go by Lilly's point scheme. One debility is hardly enough. Retrograde movement is -5 but so is Moon being in the 12th, and Saturn has many other strengths from the description.
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/dig5.html

To me, an angular planet in general has more power in a chart. A cadent one is quite weak and has trouble having control over a situation, unless another planet gives it aid somehow and is itself more powerful to do so (which we can't say without more info). This is a traditional interpretation that goes beyond point calculations. Add to that the fact that by nature Saturn usually exerts more control over other bodies due to its own planetary nature and the fact that it is the most superior body.

Event charts are not personal charts like horary, so assigning the L1 to someone because they are important to you does not work in all cases. It is better to think of them as a group experience because there are other people involved in the event. As someone mentioned, you might not even want to use L1/L7 (I would trust people who use this more frequently than I do). Is the state meet at home or somewhere else? Who is the underdog? Maybe share the chart in case others can offer an interpretation.

9
So here is the chart

Image


State meet is an away meet today in about 6 hours. My daughter is the favorite to win. I wonder if she should be represented by the 7th as is typical with general horaries and the comp 7th from the 7th or first.

Anyhow, I look forward to hearing something and I will update later or tomorrow

10
I see now, you posted a horary. I thought this was an event chart for an athletic meet. If you have a chart for that it might be interesting to share with the outcome for this group.

Daughters are 5th house (she did not ask the question so I would not give her the 1st). Venus is the 5th ruler (I use Regiomontanus though and don't know if Mars is ruler or not in that system) in detriment and afflicted by Saturn. Venus in Aries is very competitive and takes on the nature of Mars, a planet very good at athletics, but I would be surprised if she won, despite Jupiter's aid (it is cadent and retro so not very strong). Venus's dispositor is also quite weak. Maybe her team somehow fails her and Saturn might be representing a formidable opponent. Venus in detriment in the 10th can sometimes show a public embarrassment so she may feel that the event was somehow embarrassing. I have it in natal and publically embarrass myself more than I would like to. Moon is also very poorly placed and not within orb of anything.

I hope the chart is wrong though (Saturn in the 7th can show the astrologer makes poor judgment too) and wish her luck.

11
Thanks Tanit, and since you are the only one who responded with input, I will reveal the result.

My daughter was one of two that jumped the highest height but took less attempts in the competition and won the even on that tie breaking rule.

She is the State Champion

12
Thanks, Rookie. I am not really seeing that in the chart (other than Saturn in the 7th being a warning about the chart) but I am glad she did well! Congrats! Maybe the event chart might have been better? What is especially difficult here (besides the Moon, the most important body), imo, is Saturn prohibits (and afflicts) Venus from aspecting Jupiter, the radical 10th ruler and a general planet associated with gains. If anyone who uses horary for athletic predictions sees something else, hopefully they will chime in.

Some would argue that questions like this are not a good use of horary because it does not aid anyone and I am on the fence about it myself. I am not sure if event predictions are much better though. I do know that I have asked questions on how I would do on exams, which is not much different in nature, and there were charts that suggested I would do poorly where I did very well, sometimes even a top score. I do not see discrepancies like this in questions that are more relevant for horary being used as an aid in a difficult situation, though. This is just my experience. Deb seems like she agrees with this in her article on questioning horaries:
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/horary_questions.html