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Triplicities

 
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Fisher



Joined: 08 May 2014
Posts: 8
Location: Liverpool

Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 8:28 am    Post subject: Triplicities Reply with quote

Hi All

Probably a stupid question but I am in the process of learning Astrology (Zoller introduction course). But there is one element of the dignities I just cannot get my head around, Triplicities. I need an idiots explanation.

As an example, I am working with the planet Mercury (Gemini), how can I identify when Mercury is in a state of Triplicity? As you can see and totally confused on this matter!

Please be gentle!

Rob
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Paul
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Joined: 23 Nov 2009
Posts: 1544

Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 11:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So all the essential dignities can be determined by where in the zodiac a given planet is. Each one has a portion of the zodiac that a planet gains dignity when it's within it.

Triplicity is only a bit different in that it is partially determined by whether the chart in question is a day or night chart.

Included here is a table of dignities we can use as an example



As you see the table has zodiac signs along the left running from aries on the top to pisces on the bottom. Along the top are the dignities and debilites that planets find themselves in in for each sign.

So taking the first row which starts with Aries, we see the next column after sign is 'houses of the planets' which refers to the domicile dignity. Which planet has Aries as its 'planetary house' (i.e which planet has domicile dignity in Aries).
In this case, as we know, Mars rules Aries and so Mars has domicile dignity in Aries, and therefore Mars' house is shown here in Aries' row.

The next column is exaltation. Which planet has exaltation in Aries? We see the sun, which tell us that the Sun has exaltation dignity in Aries.

The next column is triplicity. We see triplicity is broken into two columns, D for diurnal/day and N for nocturnal/night. For the day, we see the Sun, for the night we see Jupiter. What this means is that if the chart is a day chart, that the Sun has triplicity dignity in Aries, if it's a night chart, Jupiter has that dignity instead.

The next section of columns is the terms of the planets. This time rather than whole signs defining a dignity, only portions of the sign do. What we see in the first column of this section is Jupiter with the number 6. What this means is that Jupiter gains term dignity from 0 of Aries right up to 5 59'. So the 6 means "jupiter gains this dignity up to 6 but not 6 itself or beyond".

The same is then true for the rest of the dignities.

One thing to note is that the table of dignities I've listed here are the dignities that William Lilly used (17th century famed English Astrologer). There are actually different sets of terms that are often used, and indeed there's another set of triplicity dignities that are used.

For the purposes of explanation and clarity I just wanted to mention that, but if you can figure out how to read this table of dignities, then you can refer to any other system you prefer or which Zoller uses and it shoudl similarly make sense.
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1219
Location: Delhi

Posted: Fri Jan 22, 2016 12:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Triplicities Reply with quote

Fisher wrote:
Hi All

Probably a stupid question but I am in the process of learning Astrology (Zoller introduction course). But there is one element of the dignities I just cannot get my head around, Triplicities. I need an idiots explanation.

As an example, I am working with the planet Mercury (Gemini), how can I identify when Mercury is in a state of Triplicity? As you can see and totally confused on this matter!

Please be gentle!

Rob

Step 1:
The time of question/birth- decides nocturnal and diurnal times.
Step 2:
Decide triplicity ownership in the table given by Paul.

Step 3: The planet can be any degree of the sign.

So,in a nocturnal horary, Mercury in Gemini(0 degree to 30 degree) would be considered in its own triplicity. Any other planet in this nocturnal horary, in Gemini,Libra or Aquarius (Whatever the degree of the planet)would be considered to be in Mercury's triplicity.

Mercury(or another planet) in Gemini 18 degree- in daytime horoscope would be in triplicity of Saturn but in terms of Venus.
Same planet in a night time chart in almost the same degree would be in Triplicity of Mercury and Terms of Venus,

PD
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Lazarus



Joined: 10 Dec 2014
Posts: 88

Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So unfortunately the Zoller course tells you something a bit different. When he wrote the course he seemed intent on using all three triplicity rulers (Dorothean system) whether the chart is diurnal or nocturnal. This doesn't make much sense to me. The only place it makes sense is when you use it to do things like divide the life into 3 parts by assigning one third of life to each triplicity ruler of the Asc, but I personally don't think that it was ever intended by the older astrologers that all three triplicity rulers should have dignity of triplicity regardless of day or night. I could be wrong but I have encountered this viewpoint a few times now and it makes more sense logically. If all three have dignity of triplicity regardless of day or night then you get pecular circumstances such as that the almuten of Cancer is always the Moon or that the almuten of Leo is always the Sun etc. and this makes this technique far less useful. So Zoller tells us to use all three triplicity rulers, so for the purposes of passing that course you might want to just do what is said but explore things for yourself as well.
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pankajdubey



Joined: 17 Nov 2006
Posts: 1219
Location: Delhi

Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lazarus wrote:
So unfortunately the Zoller course tells you something a bit different. When he wrote the course he seemed intent on using all three triplicity rulers (Dorothean system) whether the chart is diurnal or nocturnal. This doesn't make much sense to me. The only place it makes sense is when you use it to do things like divide the life into 3 parts by assigning one third of life to each triplicity ruler of the Asc, but I personally don't think that it was ever intended by the older astrologers that all three triplicity rulers should have dignity of triplicity regardless of day or night. I could be wrong but I have encountered this viewpoint a few times now and it makes more sense logically. If all three have dignity of triplicity regardless of day or night then you get pecular circumstances such as that the almuten of Cancer is always the Moon or that the almuten of Leo is always the Sun etc. and this makes this technique far less useful. So Zoller tells us to use all three triplicity rulers, so for the purposes of passing that course you might want to just do what is said but explore things for yourself as well.



Try this thread:Lee Lehman has a post in this thread.

http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=2395
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Fisher



Joined: 08 May 2014
Posts: 8
Location: Liverpool

Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good day to all

Thank you for your very comprehensive explanations. They are appreciated.

Still a little fuzzy, but will persevere
Thanks again.

Rob
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Lazarus



Joined: 10 Dec 2014
Posts: 88

Posted: Sun Jan 24, 2016 8:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the link. What Lehman says makes a lot of sense to me. At this point I give precedence to the sect triplicity rulers during delineation and then I move onto the night ruler if that one is afflicted and even the participating ruler if both are afflicted etc. This makes a certain amount of sense and we probably could conjecture that the further down the row you get with triplicity rulers the weaker the results (of course this needs to be tested). What I don't buy is the idea that Saturn in Aries has dignity of triplicity. I just personally don't see it. I would rather look and see if the chart is diurnal or nocturnal because if it is the former then Saturn in Aries is less weak but if the latter is the case then he is more malefic because he is out of sect malefic. I also don't buy using all three triplicity rulers for almuten calculations because once again then you are significantly limiting the range of results such a technique can cover. The Sun will always be almuten of Aries, for example, even in a night chart, but I then again I always take almutens with a grain of salt because if the almuten cannot see the sign by whole sign aspect it is said to have dominion over then I think this changes things quite a bit, although I need to do more research. Finally I just want to mention that I give term rulership more importance than triplicity and therefore I would also give it more points in almuten calculation. I felt this way for a long time and then discovered that this same idea is put forth by Herman of Carinthia in a text called Search of the Heart translated and annotated by Ben Dykes. Glad to see that Lehman had some insightful comments to make on that thread. I will read the entire thread when I get a chance.
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Atlantean



Joined: 14 Aug 2009
Posts: 396

Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2016 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Re: "So unfortunately the Zoller course tells you something a bit different. When he wrote the course he seemed intent on using all three triplicity rulers (Dorothean system) whether the chart is diurnal or nocturnal."

Isn't this also in (the main in) agreement with Morin?
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Lazarus



Joined: 10 Dec 2014
Posts: 88

Posted: Mon Jan 25, 2016 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I suppose but he has a different scheme for triplicity rulers. This is obviously not a simple issue. From my perspective it appears as though all three should be used for certain techniques/contexts whereas only the sect triplicity ruler should be used for certain techniques/contexts.
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