Significators

1
Hi Friends,
I have been studying Horary for several years now. My main guidance in this are the works of William Lilly and Mr. John Frawley. I just wonder if anyone could point me in the right direction with my query. John Frawley stated that you can use a collective "We", when you are asking about a situation where you are involved with another as a 1st house approach, ie. "Will we move house?", "Will we go on holiday?", etc. This would be seen as 1st house. This is also the case where you strongly identify with the subject of your query. However,if I wished to ask a question concerning two other people who were connected, but I was not, could this be viewed as a collective 7th house An example being if I wished to ask a question concerning two family members, Mother and Uncle, who were both involved in a situation but I was not, could I use 7th House to describe them as a unit? As in "Will they.......? Or say I wished to ask something like. "Will they have children?",referring to my son and his girlfriend as a unit, could they together be looked on as a collective 7th house? I have thought long and hard about this and my instincts tell me that I can, but I have not come across this in my books. I also asked the question on another forum but no one seems to know. Would any of you learned people be able to clarify this for me? thank you kindly.

2
I'm not sure I understand the context of the question you had in mind.

If you were asking about something in which you are also involved, even if others are involved with you, then that collective 'we' can be the first house.

What kind of question did you have in mind in regards your mother and uncle? Is it something they'll do together?
"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" - Socrates

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Significators?

3
Hi Paul,
They both are involved at the present time in a civil court case. The jist of the story is my grandmother died a few years back and left her property to her 4 children, two of whom are my mother and her brother, my uncle. My uncle was living with my grandmother in the property when she was alive, and he continued to live there after she passed away. This amounts to many years he has resided there. When she died their other brother along with his wife tried to force the sale of the property so the proceeds could be shared out. My uncle refused as he was living there and had nowhere else to go. They wrangled back and forth for years but nothing really came of it. However, several years ago this other brother died and now his wife is trying again to force my uncle to sell the property so she can get her hands on her husbands share. She is now taking my mum and uncle to court to force an eviction of my uncle from the property and to force a sale. My mum lives in her own property and has always kept out of the whole situation. The dispute really is just between this aunt and my uncle but because my mum has kept out of the situation she is still being dragged into it as she is a named executor too. I tried to think of the best approach to this with a chart. I know that civil trials are 1st house v 7th house. Someone else advised me to look at the separate 10th for mum, and 12th for uncle, and compare their conditions to the opponent 7th house. But I realised this would give two seperate house placements for the aunt. I could have used this approach and used the radical 7th as the opponent. So I wondered if there was an easier way to come up with a collective "They", in the chart. I am not involved in the situation and although my feelings are for my mum and uncle in this situation, (For personal reasons), I wish to remain unbiased. I am not personally involved in the situation so feel I cannot ask, "Will we win?", as Frawley suggests you can. I like to distance myself from situations so my charts remain untouched by any bias and I can judged them more clearly and accurately. And I can also see some merit in both sides of the situation too. So as it stands could I ask "Will they win?", and they would be 7th house and the opponent aunt would be given 1st house. This is where I find my greatest diffuculty when casting charts where its a situation involving maybe two or more people together and I am not involved, but asking about their situation. Its the same situation if I wished to ask "Will my son and his girlfriend have a child?". I wonder if I can just ask, "Will they have a child?", and use 7th house as them. Can you see my dillema here?

4
Hi pyramidpower

Sorry for the delay in getting back to you. Personally I would consider using the first and seventh.

Does the chart seem to be describing the situation if you use those significators? When things start to seem complicated, I usually prefer to default to something simple and resist turning the chart. A lot of people will disagree with that, I'm just a simple kind of person ;)
"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" - Socrates

https://heavenlysphere.com/

5
Hi Paul thanks for replying. Yeah I think I might agree with you there. Frawley says to keep it simple. When you try to turn charts it can get oh soooo complicated. I think the best approach would be "Will she win?", and give her the 7th of open enemy and my mum and uncle as !st. Do you think this would be right?

6
pyramidpower wrote:Hi Paul thanks for replying. Yeah I think I might agree with you there. Frawley says to keep it simple. When you try to turn charts it can get oh soooo complicated. I think the best approach would be "Will she win?", and give her the 7th of open enemy and my mum and uncle as !st. Do you think this would be right?
Ye it's probably what I would do to be honest, whether that's right or wrong, I don't know.

Especially if the chart seems to describe the events if you do this, significators may describe people or something of that nature.

The alternative would be to not use horary but look at the event chart and let Lord 1 signify the plaintiff who is initiating action.
"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing" - Socrates

https://heavenlysphere.com/

7
Thanks for your guidance Paul. It seems the only plausible approach. The court date is set for August so i can try the event chart. I have never done one before so this is as good a time as any. Ill tel you what as well Paul, just when you think you have sussed something another thing comes along to test you with Horary. Its true what they say, a never ending study. Anyway cheers for your help Paul, I will post at some point the chart and what my analysis is, "once I think I have sussed it out ha ha". Afterwards once the outcome is known I will post the answer. I did do an earlier Horary asking if she would win. I used her as the 7th of open enemy. But because I could'nt figure out whos side I was on this is what sparked my question of a "They" situation. Cheers Paul.