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Islamic Caliphate Declared by ISIS
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Mark
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nathan wrote:
Quote:
Mark, I've also been trying to find an accurate date - The first tweet regarding the declaration that I could find was 09:29, 29th June 2014 Ar-Raqqah, Syria. - 35N57, 30E01 - thanks.


Thanks Nathan,

Ahh tweets! As a technophobe I forgot all about that!

On his blog Pieter van Ostaeyen stated:

Quote:
One of ISIS’s official Twitter accounts added: Coming soon by Allah’s permission: Good News for the Muslim Ummah “This Is the Promise of Allah”

And indeed; not even two hours later they released a new audio statement by ISIS official spokesman Abu Muhammad al-’Adnani, titled “This is the Promise of Allah”.


But this tweet timing doesn't match the timing he gives. I dont know much about Tweets. Is the timing data on Tweets like this reliable? What did this first tweet actually say?

Clearly we may need to reconsider the possibility of the announcement around noon local time. This would fit the BBC & French media sources Michael referred to. Michael do you have any links to those news reports?
I searched the internet for hours late on Sunday/early Monday and certainly found no BBC reference to noon then.

If that is correct midday prayers would have been a consideration for an Islamic group like this.

Mark
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ModWasp



Joined: 21 Mar 2014
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
But this tweet timing doesn't match the timing he gives. I dont know much about Tweets. Is the timing data on Tweets like this reliable? What did this first tweet actually say?


I've just sent a message so hopefully he'll reply. I'll let you know.

I worked in investigative journalism for several years - social media is probably the most reliable form of data available for a situation such as this - certainly more so than the bbc. As it's instant, touch of a button stuff, getting info from people on the ground is far more reliable than getting it from the bloke who's sitting in his bedroom in Hounslow. Thumbs up
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ModWasp



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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

UPDATE

Here is the link to the first posting that i've come across announcing the ISIS Cailphate Islamic State from ISIS itself - the time is 8.05am - i think that's GMT, so what, -3 hours?
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ModWasp



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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark 05.05am seems the most likely time - either just before or just after the morning prayer.
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Mark
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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nathan wrote:
Quote:
Mark 05.05am seems the most likely time - either just before or just after the morning prayer.


Thanks very much Nathan.

Nathan wrote:
Quote:
Here is the link to the first posting that i've come across announcing the ISIS Cailphate Islamic State from ISIS itself


Afraid your link above didn't work. Do you know the message that went out with the tweet?

Its an interesting sign of the times that a state can now be declared by tweet! I must say I always considered tweeting a largely frivolous form of social media before now but maybe I am just showing my dinosaur credentials.

I suppose the creation of new states needs to move with the times. The People's Republic of China was declared by a radio broadcast by Mao in 1949 so I guess tweets and online statements are the modern equivalent.

These Muslims of ISIS are quite a paradox with a hybrid of medieval theology and 21st century technology.

Getting back to the chart for the Caliphate assuming the tweet does explicitly make a clear declaration that could be the basis of a chart. Although world attention seems to have only taken this seriously after the release of that online video by ISIS declaring the Caliphate.

So we are presumably looking at a different times for the transmission of the online video and the tweet.

What do others think?

Mark
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james_m



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Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mark,

i have a twitter account, but don't actively use it. my immediate thought verifies nathan's commentary. this is probably the best means of getting the actual time and yes, twitter is very much in vogue for this type of thing.. i am resistant to this as well, but did immediately think i could probably do better utilizing this approach for finding up to the minute accuracy of news releases and information.. unfortunately i have little appetite for twitter!

james
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Geoffrey



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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 5:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark wrote:

These Muslims of ISIS are quite a paradox with a hybrid of medieval theology and 21st century technology.


The leaders of the Islamic State, as they prefer to be called now, have a reputation for being 'social media savvy'. That the founding of the state should be announced by a Tweet seems in keeping with this reputation. Perhaps we should expect some sign of this in the chart as validation of it. Perhaps a lot of stuff - or main significators - in air...?
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ModWasp



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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Perhaps we should expect some sign of this in the chart as validation of it. Perhaps a lot of stuff - or main significators - in air...?


I have two different times 05.05am and 06.20am - both from social media sources on 29.6.2014 Ar-Raqqah, Syria

At first glance, the 05.05 chart seems to fit quite nicely with what i know about this organisation.
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james_m



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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i agree with nathan that the 505am chart (18 cancer rising is what i get via ar raqqah syria eet - 2) looks like a pretty good fit, as opposed to the 620am chart.. ascendant on this chart is at the sun/moon midpoint which is an indication of greater public exposure for the time..

not that this has much to do with religion, i would be wondering when the call to prayer was and whether 5:05am was before or after. can anyone find that out?
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ModWasp



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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

James_M

The time that i have is 05.05 Local time - ASC 05 Cancer 00 - the Sun is just on the horizon at 07cancer17

MC 16Pisces15

- 2nd Cusp 26Cancer01 - Jupiter conjunct Moon at 26Cancer11/41 in the 2nd. - I've only used this because i hear that ISIS has monetary resources of around $2BILLION at their disposal.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/15/iraq-isis-arrest-jihadists-wealth-power

EDIT: Looking at the 0505 chart again - i've noticed that the ASC is in Mars' term and the Sun is in Jupiter's term - both Moon and Jupiter being in term of Venus - Mars' dispositer - not good!
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james_m



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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 7:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks nathan,

it seems i have to make the adjustment myself with dst on solar fire at present. i don't have to do that in many places, but it is giving me eet -2 while the addition of dst makes it eet - 3.. i get 5 cancer rising when i do this. i understand your logic, but now i am not so convinced..
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ModWasp



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Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2014 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No problem James

as i may have mentioned - the times are from social media - which is often more spontaneous than the MSM.

The early prayers time was an educated guess, based on savvy and SM - i shall continue trying to find an accurate time, but as i rather suspect, due to the nature of the very organisation that we are discussing, that might not be possible


However - i think the 5ºCancer ASC chart is worth studying not only for the 2nd house things, but Lord 8 is in the 5th - death is as a game.
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Mark
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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2014 6:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nathan wrote:
Quote:
The early prayers time was an educated guess, based on savvy and SM - i shall continue trying to find an accurate time, but as i rather suspect, due to the nature of the very organisation that we are discussing, that might not be possible.


The morning prayer for Muslims is called Fajr and starts at dawn and completes before sunrise.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fajr_prayer

Here are local prayer and sunrise times for Ar Raqqah, Syria this week:

http://www.muslimpro.com/Prayer-times-in-Ar-Raqqah-Syria-172955

So 5:05 Local time (2:05 GMT) is consistent with someone who had completed their morning prayer before sunrise.

Nathan did you make any more progress on the actual wording of the twitter release? That seems fundamental to clarify if we are going to rely on this time.

I still feel the timing of the video release (whenever it actually was!) may be even more astrologically significant. However, that timing seems lost in a flurry of conflicting reports. I guess we should be grateful for having what we have.

Mark
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ModWasp



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Posted: Fri Jul 04, 2014 10:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark

I've been trying to find that tweet - here's the user account - good luck! ***GRAPHIC CONTENT*** https://twitter.com/g34_s

I've just had a look at a few videos on YouTube - here's an example - http://youtu.be/IqoMH3d7hU0

This video has been shot in the early morning - you can just see the Sun on the horizon - i think the 05.05am time is about as accurate as we can expect to find, unless there's something more official confirmed.

The news reports that I've read so far have all been published several hours after this event - the news organisations will have you know that they're up-to-the-minute - take it from me, they're not!

Secret
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Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2014 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark

Quote:
I still feel the timing of the video release (whenever it actually was!) may be even more astrologically significant. However, that timing seems lost in a flurry of conflicting reports. I guess we should be grateful for having what we have.


The title of this video http://youtu.be/NjQNkfn1dEc

Is titled "Tenderness | | joy that was such bliss breakfast at the roundabout on the occasion of the Declaration of the Islamic Caliphate 29-6"
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