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Will she get the job?
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Kren



Joined: 28 May 2004
Posts: 38

Posted: Fri Mar 04, 2005 12:01 pm    Post subject: Will she get the job? Reply with quote

Hi,

I see lots of job-related discussion here but I still need help, Smile

My boss is retiring at the end of April and my co-worker wants his position. I really want her to have this position. She would be a great asset as Director of our department.

I am asking the question, "Will Jenny get the job?" I'm confused about what significators to use for Jenny. Well, I'm confused about the entire chart, so any comments would be greatly appreciated. This is a Criminal Justice position and the office is IN a jail.

March 4, 2005, 5:50 a.m. CST, Harker Heights, Tx 31N05 97W39
Ascendant 20'47" Aquarius, Moon 23'53 Sag

THANKS!

Kren
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Deb
Administrator


Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 4130
Location: England

Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote



I've changed this now to show the correct chart


Last edited by Deb on Mon Mar 07, 2005 3:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kurgal



Joined: 04 Jan 2005
Posts: 197
Location: Auckland, New Zealand

Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 11:15 am    Post subject: Re: Will she get the job? Reply with quote

Kren wrote:
. This is a Criminal Justice position and the office is IN a jail.


Well there you go. According to the chart Deb posted, MC (job) ruler is Mars - situated in the 12th House of prisons!!
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Kren



Joined: 28 May 2004
Posts: 38

Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 12:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Deb, thanks for posting a chart but it doesn't match the ascendant I posted of my chart. We use Regiomontus for this, right? CST is +6 if that makes a difference.

In the chart I cast, the 10th house is Sag. (There is an interception in Virgo/Pisces) If I use the 7th house as the significator of Jenny, the person I 'm asking about - is that correct?

If so, her ruler is the Sun and is applying to Jupiter, ruler of the 10th. Indicating a positive answer?? Does the fact that it is applying to a quincunx affect the outcome at all? Would that indicate that there might be problems/obstacles in getting the position - such as a power struggle or lawsuit or other delay?

Thanks again,
Kren
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MarkF



Joined: 22 Oct 2003
Posts: 523
Location: Outside Washington, DC

Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I did the chart myself using SolarFire and I got the same chart that you did, not the one that’s posted here.

I don’t think you’d use the 7th house for your friend. I thought you’d use the 11th house. If she were just a co-worker with whom you have no other kind of relationship you might use the 3rd house. But since you seem to know her on a personal level and wish well for her, you’d use the 11th. The 7th is for our “opposites” – rivals and lovers mainly. But it all depends on your relationship with this person.

So, if you use the 11th house, your friend is Jupiter in the 8th house. The Moon is separating from being sextile and is applying to Mercury. So maybe the time for her has passed.

I can see the problem you had with this. Because the job’s significator is then Jupiter as well, so what is Jupiter then, the job or your friend? The same is true for the 12th house ruler Saturn, which also is your 1st house ruler. Maybe you could use the Moon for your friend and let Jupiter represent the job. I’m not sure about that at all.

But… if you turn the chart and if Jupiter is your friend Jenny, then Jupiter is in her turned 10th house. But the Moon is still separating, which doesn’t support that view.

It does seem that whatever Jupiter is – your friend or the job itself, the fact that the Moon is separating means that the time for this has passed. The rest is kind of a blur for me.
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Mark F
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Kren



Joined: 28 May 2004
Posts: 38

Posted: Sat Mar 05, 2005 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I appreciate the look and the reply, Mark. I'll keep staring at it and see if any bright thoughts come to mind...

Based on your description, I agree the 11th house sounds right for her significator. Yep, the rest is confusing!

The opening won't be anounced for a few weeks yet, so we'll see what transpires.

Thanks,

Kren
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Deb
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Joined: 11 Oct 2003
Posts: 4130
Location: England

Posted: Mon Mar 07, 2005 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Kren,

Sorry for putting the wrong chart up. I can’t think why I did that since you mentioned the ascendant in your original post! I’m a bit busy this week so I haven’t had much chance to explore the recent posts, but looking at this chart, I’d also say that the 11th house influence is being emphasised because the Moon’s position often shows where the real focus of the question lies.
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Kren



Joined: 28 May 2004
Posts: 38

Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2005 11:44 am    Post subject: Update Reply with quote

Well I guess the chart is correct about her chances for getting this position. My dear friend was in a terrible auto accident last week and is unconscious in Intensive Care with multiple broken bones and a very serious head injury. She's had two brain surgeries and needs your prayers.

A very sad Kren.
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Sungem



Joined: 27 Feb 2005
Posts: 206
Location: Australia

Posted: Wed Mar 23, 2005 11:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Kren

I'm very saddened to hear the news of your friend's accident. What touches a member of the forum, touches us all in some way and of course I'll put her in my healing prayers.

best wishes
Sungem
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haku



Joined: 22 Oct 2003
Posts: 142

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2005 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

how terrible. i hope she will recover well.
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Pete



Joined: 29 Apr 2004
Posts: 301
Location: Kinnelon, New Jersey, USA

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2005 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Kren,
I was in the middle of looking at the horary when I read your post about your friend's accident. This is a terrible thing to have happened to her and I sincerely hope she makes a good recovery.

What I was going to say about the chart was that I thought she had a good chance to get the job based on the fact that her ruler, Jupiter, is in the turned 10th in M/R with Venus, ruling her 10th, but there were two points that puzzled me: first - the immediate application of the Moon to conjunct Pluto on your friends ascendant (11th cusp), and secondly the fact that Mars translates the light from Jupiter to Saturn, with Saturn sitting on her 8th house cusp and ruling her 3rd house.
Maurice McCann - an astrologer I respect very much - has noticed that when 3 planets are involved in a translation or collection of light they become locked into each other and this cuts them off from any further involvement in the rest of the chart. Now, with the value of hindsight I'm looking at the translation between Mars, Jupiter and Saturn and I can see how Mars was about to bring your friend to Saturn, who sits on the 6th cusp of accident and injury. I realise that this observation may appear trite and pointless under the circumstances but nevertheless as students of horary it remains a point of interpretation worth noting.

Again, my thoughts are with your friend in her hour of ordeal...
==
Pete
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Kren



Joined: 28 May 2004
Posts: 38

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2005 11:16 am    Post subject: My Thanks Reply with quote

Thank you all for your kind thoughts and prayers. Everywhere I go people are offering to pray for Jenny. It is very heartening. Pete, your response is not trite at all. We ask a question, we get an answer. I thank you,

Kren
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 566

Posted: Thu Mar 24, 2005 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kren,
I do hope that your friend recovers; it just goes to show how transient or unpredictable life can be; we should be thankful for every waking and healthy moment that we are given...

"Pete:"
Quote:
What I was going to say about the chart was that I thought she had a good chance to get the job based on the fact that her ruler, Jupiter, is in the turned 10th in M/R with Venus, ruling her 10th, but there were two points that puzzled me: first - the immediate application of the Moon to conjunct Pluto on your friends ascendant (11th cusp), and secondly the fact that Mars translates the light from Jupiter to Saturn, with Saturn sitting on her 8th house cusp and ruling her 3rd house.

That's fascinating, Pete. In retrospect, the conjunction of the Moon to Pluto is so obvious and formidable. (These malefics will be the end of us!!) It's one degree, right? Do you see a correspondence in the time frames? I don't have the chart before me..

Quote:
Maurice McCann - an astrologer I respect very much - has noticed that when 3 planets are involved in a translation or collection of light they become locked into each other and this cuts them off from any further involvement in the rest of the chart.

Yes, but doesn't all translation and collection involve atleast 3 planets? And what does it mean that it cuts them off from any further involvement and how does it apply to this chart?

Thanks.
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Taurus7



Joined: 23 Oct 2003
Posts: 566

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The final aspect of the Moon is the square to Mercury, ruler of her turned 6th. And if we don't take into consideration the outer planets (i.e. Pluto), then, in fact, it's the only aspect that the Moon makes before it changes signs. That's pretty telling as well, isn't it?
It would appear to me that this horary is perhaps not answering the question asked, but instead telling what actually happened. Pete, I know you have often said that a horary chart should be used solely to answer the question that is asked, and the horary should not be used to delineate anything further. What would you say about this?

Kren, I do hope your friend recovers. It seems almost wrong to analyze this chart based on what happened, a woman is fighting for her life. My apologies if I am out of place here....
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Pete



Joined: 29 Apr 2004
Posts: 301
Location: Kinnelon, New Jersey, USA

Posted: Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
That's fascinating, Pete. In retrospect, the conjunction of the Moon to Pluto is so obvious and formidable. (These malefics will be the end of us!!) It's one degree, right? Do you see a correspondence in the time frames? I don't have the chart before me..

Well on March 23rd Kren posted that her friend had been involved in an accident "last week". This would put the date of the accident at sometime between March 14th and 20th. The horary was drawn up on March 4th: two weeks previously. The Moon applies to Pluto in less than one degree and the Moon is fast, so the time correspondence is clear: within the month.
Quote:
Yes, but doesn't all translation and collection involve atleast 3 planets?

Yes, as it does in this case. Mars is translating the light from Jupiter to Saturn. Mars is two degrees from the opposition to Saturn, so the timing is two *something*. As it turned out it was two weeks to the accident.
Quote:
And what does it mean that it cuts them off from any further involvement and how does it apply to this chart?

Garry Phillipson's interview with Maurice McCann in "The Traditional Astrologer", issue 17, is fascinating. In part, McCann uses the simile of radio signals when refering to the energies of the planets. At one point he says this:
Quote:
"Another thing is this: where you have one translation of light - the Moon with Venus and Mars; and Mercury is applying to conjunct the Venus, and is within orb. That Mercury cannot aspect the Venus because the Venus is involved in the trio with the Moon and Mars. Once they are in translation, other planets cannot apply to them. They are kept out. Also, whilst they are in the trio, they cannot go out and aspect another planet.. This blew me away! I felt the hair stand on end when I discovered that. There are games being played up in the sky with three planets. They get together in a little gang, and they won't let anybody join. And they won't let anybody leave. They are locked in there until as time goes by they change, and join other gangs........that's what I have experienced with horary work; it was the only plausible and consistent wayI could find to answer the problems I found in charts."

That whole passage is fascinating enough, but then he says something that made *my* hair stand on end when I read it again just now:
Quote:
"Imagine a chart were the Moon translates Venus to Mars. Now say the Sun is trying to conjunct Venus - or Venus is applying to the Sun. That would be combustion, which is bad; but because Venus is in that translation the Sun can't touch it. So this brings up another idea: because the Sun is in orb for combustion...it should destroy Venus, but it can't because Venus is tied in with this triangle. So the Sun's power is suddenly taken away because of the translation; the Sun should destroy Venus, and it can't do it."

Now *that* is a fascinating point of interpretation!

In this chart, Jupiter - Kren's friend - is "locked into" the translation of light with Mars and Saturn. Mars has grabbed Jupiter, if you will, and is taking it to Saturn. Both Saturn and Mars are traditional malefics and here they are joint almuten-rulers of the 12th house. This suggests not only will she not get the job but it offers the reason why: Mars, Saturn, 12th house - hospitalisation. Jupiter rules the turned 12th as well, so this house is highlighted twice in the translation.
Sorry for the long-winded reply but I wanted to include the quotes from the interview to clarify McCann's ideas.
==
Pete
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