Quiz Chart--Love Horary (outcome known)

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Hello all. This is a personal love horary and it does have an outcome. The question was, "Will JV and I ever get together," as in, will we ever be in a relationship or explicitly romantically involved?

This was someone who I had met when substitute teaching in a long-term substitute position (the school had opened up a new classroom just for the last month of school and the principal had asked me to teach it). At the end of the first week of class there (I was definitely not looking for love!) felt like I very suddenly fell in love with this person who I'll call JV (I am female, he is male). I was terrified of it though, it was so strong, and I had had a bad experience falling for a co-worker before, and I wanted to just focus on being professional instead.

I became nervous around him, mostly just averted my eyes around him because the job itself was stressful enough (this was an alternative school for kids who had been suspended from their main schools, it was the first time I had ever taught my own class, I had to teach all 5 subjects, so it was stressful in many ways already, without the uncertainty of a romantic interest to boot).

Anyway, we never had the chance to really talk to each other, though I think he tried, and definitely never had the chance for him to ask me to hang out or anything, when the school year ended. The semester had just ended when I asked this question.

What do you think happened? What details can you understand from the chart information? I'll give a week or so depending upon interest and then respond with the answer.[/img]
Gabby

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What do you think happened? What details can you understand from the chart information? I'll give a week or so depending upon interest and then respond with the answer.[/img]
We would appreciate if you send the answer/outcome to Deb (Administrator) or Paul (Moderator)right now. It would ensure that you would not change the outcome once you receive the interpretations from members. This would be more in the spirit of 'Quiz'.
Regards

Morpheus

https://horusastropalmist.wordpress.com/

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Morpheus wrote: We would appreciate if you send the answer/outcome to Deb (Administrator) or Paul (Moderator)right now.
Sounds like fun, when gabkins indicates the quiz is over, I'll paste her full reply here so everyone can get the feedback they require.

Gabkins when the quiz is over it would be useful if you would share your own insights on the chart, and what your own judgement was when you first drew up the chart.

(edit: thanks Johannes, I've corrected the gender. Apologies, I wasn't paying attention)
Last edited by Paul on Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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According to Masha'allah's approach, primary testimony pertains to the Moon as it is angular in the house of the matter and beholds the ASC.
Venus as the ASC lady participates from the 2nd, bringing the money issue to the fore in some way.
As Venus is in aversion to the ASC, I doubt your ability to manage the matter properly i.e. it has suffered from your disjunction/disconnection with yourself, leaving you confused and 'lost'.

There are several compelling arguments for a 'yes' answer

- the Moon in the house of the matter
- Mars as the lord of the matter in the ASC
- application between the two with mutual reception

Fixed signs/pivots are involved and this reinforces the probability of effecting the matter and its stability.

Problems are indicated by

- the Moon/Mars application by opposition
- Mars under the rays
- south node in the 1st
- Saturn as a contrary to sect/peregrine/retrograde malefic out of its domain (actually totally ex conditione) in the house of the matter

The opposition can perfect a matter but with great efforts/difficulties even with reception involved.

Being under the rays is a weakening influence but here it shouldn't be all to great because the Sun is separating from Mars. Some authority/job/money issue may have burdened him, but it may also mean he has had to keep 'low profile/hide' for some reason.
Thus by definition, Mars would have to return the Moon's light which amounts to a quick end of the relationship after initial enthusiasm, due to hardships/depressing conditions - death of someone close to him? Debts?

South node in the 1st is generally a bad influence, bringing damage/slander to the querent - some sort of a disapproval/condemnation by the community?

Saturn is probably the most negative influence here, as it is placed in the house of the matter. The Moon's last aspect was with that same Saturn, accentuating all of its accidental/natural significations - he's actually "behind" the question!

There's probably some kind of (recurring) responsibility/restriction he has to live with which seriously hampers his freedom - his hands are probably tied in one way or another.
As it rules the radical 9th/10th, your career/job/mother proves to be an obstacle/burden, as well as the issue(s) of distance/religion/culture/law - Mars/Saturn are both malefics naturally representing differences which tend to separate people and (over)complicate relationships - a foreigner?
As Saturn also rules the mundane 11th, it is also possible some (older) friend is a kind of a "pressure".

When we turn the chart, Saturn rules his 3rd/4th/5th houses, so his kin, family/lineage/father and/or possibly his child may have proven to be a problem. Saturn is occidental and naturally rules old age, so I think a greater difference in years may have posed an additional restriction.

All in all, I'd say you two did form a relationship but with hardships and a lot of effort after three...weeks? :D

The angles tend to hasten/arouse/establish the matter (especially with the help of reception) but the opposition is what bothers me. Coupled with that angular Saturn, I'm prone to think it has ruined the whole thing pretty soon afterwards - if it allowed perfection at all.

If by any chance the relationship still exists, it survives probably only on the account of the sheer stubbornness/fixity/persistence of the signs involved and the mutual reception between the angular Moon/Mars which speak of a great deal of mutual attraction, even love which is able to mitigate the problems/differences I've mentioned.

Regards,
Goran
Last edited by cor scorpii on Thu Sep 26, 2013 10:08 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Paul wrote:
Morpheus wrote: We would appreciate if you send the answer/outcome to Deb (Administrator) or Paul (Moderator)right now.
Sounds like fun, when gabkins indicates the quiz is over, I'll paste his full reply here so everyone can get the feedback they require.

Gabkins when the quiz is over it would be useful if you would share your own insights on the chart, and what your own judgement was when you first drew up the chart.
Gabby wrote: I very suddenly fell in love with this person who I'll call JV (I am female, he is male).
1. Gabby, thanks for your very interesting question.

2. The claim to deposit the answer is near to be ridiculously distrustful in my opinion.

3. Paul, with her onw text it should be clear that Gabby is a she.

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3. Paul, with her onw text it should be clear that Gabby is a she.
Haha, thanks! I was about to point that out to him. :) It is a gender-neutral name though, so easy to be confused.
Gabby

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Applying oppositions in mutual detriment, South node and Caput Algol in 1st and retro Saturn in 7th.

This is a an infatuation horary with candle burning at both ends.
Say no more.

In my own similar horaries, had me thinking-
Agreed, I am a nut case but that girl was definitely looney !!
(I am a male and 7th was the female) :lala

PD

winner!

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Well, there were not a lot of takers here, but we still have a winner in pankajdubey.

he writes:
This is a an infatuation horary with candle burning at both ends.
Say no more.
This is exactly what it was. Although I truly felt like I was falling in love. I will email Paul and he can post what I originally sent him as the explanation of the outcome.

The guy ended up getting a girlfriend that summer (while school was out and we weren't working together or seeing each other) and I believe got her pregnant. I had a dream during the summer in which he came to me and said, "I'm sorry, but I got another woman pregnant."

Then suddenly, according to facebook, he was in a relationship. 3 months later, they were engaged!

I did go back to substitute teach at that school, but it was like we couldn't speak to each other! Also, I knew (thanks to facebook) that he had a girlfriend. I was still wanting him though, and could tell that he still wanted me, but it was like we were incapitated. Eventually I decided to stop subbing there. A week after I decided never to substitute teach at that school again, his facebook shows that he got engaged.

cor scorpii said:
As Venus is in aversion to the ASC, I doubt your ability to manage the matter properly i.e. it has suffered from your disjunction/disconnection with yourself, leaving you confused and 'lost'.
Well that was definitely true. In the beginning I was actually even not sure how I felt. I was definitely confused. It was a bit overwhelming.
There are several compelling arguments for a 'yes' answer

- the Moon in the house of the matter
- Mars as the lord of the matter in the ASC
- application between the two with mutual reception
The opposition can perfect a matter but with great efforts/difficulties even with reception involved.
That is all true, and what I thought when originally reading the chart was that it would not be easy (love usually isn't for me though so used to it!) but because my feelings were so strong I was willing and interested in still seeing what these feelings were about and what could come of it.

In terms of horary, it LOOKS like a very strong mutual reception BUT both planets are so debilitated they cannot receive each other. The fact that querent and quesited are in each other's houses shows that we are both equally and strongly interested.

I would like to point out some things I think are notable and interesting about the chart:

1.) Caput Algol conjunct quesited. Signifies "losing ones head." On more than one occasion I witnessed him having such a strong emotional reaction to me (difficult, like his emotions were about to do him in) that this symbol seems highly accurate.

2.) South Node on quesited, North Node on querent (me). I don't know how most people here read nodes, but to me it seems to indicate a definite karmic connection. This situation, though painful, was a catalyst for me in some very positive ways.

3.) In Bonatti's rules for unfaithfulness, he seems to link the south node as an indicator of unfaithfulness, and north node with faithfulness. Well, I was faithful to him, almost like being monogamous even before getting into a relationship with him. He was not. So the nodal axis in the chart also seems to indicate this (I didn't get that part of the chart's message until much later on and with further study on nodes in horary though).
Gabby

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As requested, here's gabkins' judgement that was sent to me:
This is what happened:

I continued to have feelings for JV well into the summer break, though we did not see each other during that time. In July, I had a dream about him, in which he told he he was sorry but that he had gotten another woman pregnant. A couple weeks later, I had an intuition to look at his Facebook profile. He had uploaded a new profile pic just a few days before of him and a new girlfriend, who (according to facebook) he had begun dating at the end of June.

When school started back up, after not seeing him during the summer months, I did go back and substitute teach at the school where I had met JV. Even though he had a girlfriend, I still wanted to know what to make of these feelings. It was confusing, because it had seemed like his feelings were very strong for me too.

When I went back, it confirmed for me that I definitely still had strong feelings for him, and he also definitely seemed very aware/interested in me and had a very strong emotional reaction to me. We kept trying to talk to each other but couldn't. Seriously, this could have been an absurdist play it was so bizarre, but also super stressful.

Finally I decided I just had to stop substitute teaching at that school, because the anxiety of it was too much for me. It became obvious to me that we were not going to be able to even get to know each other as friends.

A week after I decided to stop subbing there, he got engaged to his girlfriend. Makes me wonder if my dream was correct and that she is really pregnant, but who knows.

I see all of this playing out in the chart, interested to see how other people see it. The other woman is hard to spot. I have an idea of where to find her, but again, interested to see how others interpret this.

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Saturn was definitely too influential here,a major blockage that didn't allow for anything meaningful to develop ('taken' by another woman). Mars's detriment and the Moon's fall, south node in the 1st have probably taken their part of the toll as well. This time, the mutual reception was not strong enough to push the matter beyond the restrictions posed by Saturn.

A very instructive example, thanks :)

Regards,
Goran
http://7heavenastrology.wordpress.com
http://klasicnaastrologija.wordpress.com