Snowden and Jyotish

1
Snowden's chart is AA.

http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Snowden,_Edward

With Raman's Ayanasha:

His Saturn, the yogakarak for Taurus ascendant is Exalted but retrograde.He is currently in Saturn Mahadasa.

It is said (I think in Saravali)that the period of a retrograde planets makes the native run(spin) like a potter's wheel(Kulaal chakra).

Next two sub-periods: currently Rahu (in 2nd) and next Jupiter(in 7th and retrograde) are both in maraka places.
Interestingly, his Yogini dasa also involves Rahu and Saturn.

His natal moon is in Libra(Tula) and he is the seven and a half year cycle(Sade-sati) of Saturn.(First revolution)
Transit Jupiter in Mithuna being 9th from moon, saved him to a safer place and a long journey.

He will have to wait till 2016 for his mercury mahadasa to start and yogini of moon.That will also end his sade-sati.

2
Pankajdubey wrote:
It is said (I think in Saravali)that the period of a retrograde planets makes the native run(spin) like a potter's wheel(Kulaal chakra).
Thats a lovely way of putting it and so apt in this instance!

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

3
Hello pankajdubey,

I assume you relying mostly on the Vimshottari dasas here? Just a bit confused as you refer to Yogini dasas too.

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

4
I normally dismiss Vedic Astrology because it doesn`t work at the personality level. But the predictions,albeit after the fact ,appear more convincing than Western tropical. I don`t see why he would do this at this time,based on tropical chart

update: J?piter was transiting Sun Mars conjunction when it all started.He would do something daring.
I learned from the Chinese not to think that if A is right ,B must be wrong,so it is possible that both Astrologies work.
But if one is wrong,then maybe we have to look at rulerships.
Saturn rules 9th and 10th in Vedic system, J?piter the 8th.
In tropical it rules 8th and 9th plus MC. J?piter the 7th.
I would expect to see the 12th of subversive actions and betrayal involved. Any views appreciated

edit: Mars and Sun rule 12th and 4th of motherland in Jyotish,so it begins to make sense.Betrayal(12) of nation.But does the 12th stand for subversion in Indian astrology as well?Jupiter transits the lords and is lord of 8th. All lords of evil houses involved.
Now I`d like to hear the tropicalists :brows

5
Dragonqueen wrote:
Now I`d like to hear the tropicalists
You will not have much success on this particular forum. By definition most practitioners of Indian astrology use a sidereal zodiac.

I am a tropicalist but find Indian astrology intellectually fascinating. Perhaps because its such an intellectual challenge with all the strange terminology and concepts it throws up. I think its a good exercise in challenging your assumptions. There are such a vast array of techniques and rules I do sometimes wonder how any ordinary mortal bring brings this down to earth for a practical astrological synthesis in a reading.

I also think the Nakshatras can be utilised without having to adopt the sidereal 12 sign zodiac.

As for tropicalists bear in mind there are lots in differences in the predictive techniques used too. Transits are quite a crude tool and really only trigger events indicated by other techniques. There are other techniques worth combining with them with such as primary directions, profections, secondary progressions, solar returns, solar arcs, eclipses etc.

Mark
Last edited by Mark on Fri Jul 19, 2013 9:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

6
Thanks Mark

It came to mind that J?piter is exalted in tropical but in fall in Vedic, so it might be a big break to find out whether J?piter positively affects Cancer issues or negatively affects Geminiissues.
According to Vedic astrologers the current J?piter and Saturn transit is bad for my finances,relations etc, yet in 1989 as well as in 2001,Jupiter in 2nd and Saturn in 8th didn`t prevent me earning Money.In 2001 I began to make some Money with astrology,but this is my personal experience.
Recently a Vedic friend sent me this

"A Vedic astrologer explained how the problems to Scorpio and Taurus ascendants would likely be greater in the coming year, due to a massing of slow moving planets in the signs of Aries, Gemini and Libra, with these ascendant either turning the planets into malefics or situating them in a bad house. We can follow promising horoscopes with either of these ascendants, to see if the developments are in some sense unusual, given these transits.

Is it an accident or fate that after Jupiter entered Gemini on June 1, 2013, it seemed that the problems for Egypt increased.
- Egypt got into a tense argument with neighbor Ethiopia over its plans to dam the Nile - the lifeblood of Egypt. President Morsi even threatened to wage war unless the plans were abandoned.
- People in Egypt were upset by President Mursi staffing the Governorships in the country with Moslim Brotherhood loyalists.

7
Dragonqueen,

What predictive tools are you using to assess these charts? All I see you referring to are transits.

Mark
Last edited by Mark on Fri Jul 19, 2013 8:19 pm, edited 3 times in total.
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

8
Mark wrote:Dragonqueen,

What predictive tools are you using to assess these charts? All I see you referring to are transits.

Mark
Well, like Snowden I am in Saturn 19 year Dasha,which ends in November.
But yes I am using transits alone given what some astrologers say based only on people`s AC.
To be honest I didnt pay attention as to whether recente months were detrimental for students(gemini), but I know that where I live more and more teachers are getting jobless
J?piter in Gemini might be bad for the church too

9
Dragonqueen wrote:
Is it an accident or fate that after Jupiter entered Gemini on June 1, 2013, it seemed that the problems for Egypt increased.
- Egypt got into a tense argument with neighbor Ethiopia over its plans to dam the Nile - the lifeblood of Egypt. President Morsi even threatened to wage war unless the plans were abandoned.
- People in Egypt were upset by President Mursi staffing the Governorships in the country with Moslim Brotherhood loyalists.
The upheaval in Egypt and the middle east go back much further than this summer. They can be dated to the beginning of 2011 which coincided with the ingress of Jupiter into tropical Aries. The recent crisis and the toppling of Morsi fits better with the ingress of Jupiter into tropical Cancer from June 26th. Morsi was toppled on July 3rd.

http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworl ... upxml.html

Take a look at this thread from the mundane forum:
http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=5989

The Jupiter ingress into Cancer also brought Jupiter into an applying conjunction with Mars in one of the main charts for Egypt (1953)

Better keep in mind the title of this thread though as this topic is neither related to Snowden or Jyotish!

Mark
Last edited by Mark on Fri Jul 19, 2013 9:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

10
It certainly does.Cancer is the people and J?piter supports it. It may be a sign to the west too.People are tired of the way capitalism is harming them,the gaps betwen rich and poor.More coming up as the opposition to Pluto approaches. I had forgotten the Aries ingress. Well spot on Mark

11
Mark wrote:Hello pankajdubey,

I assume you relying mostly on the Vimshottari dasas here? Just a bit confused as you refer to Yogini dasas too.

Mark
the sub period reference is to Vimshottari and with Raman's Ayanamsha(or Suryasiddhantawhich is very close).

Yogini dasa involving the same planets is interesting as well.

PD

12
dragonqueen wrote:Thanks Mark

It came to mind that J?piter is exalted in tropical but in fall in Vedic, so it might be a big break to find out whether J?piter positively affects Cancer issues or negatively affects Geminiissues.
According to Vedic astrologers the current J?piter and Saturn transit is bad for my finances,relations etc, yet in 1989 as well as in 2001,Jupiter in 2nd and Saturn in 8th didn`t prevent me earning Money.In 2001 I began to make some Money with astrology,but this is my personal experience.
Recently a Vedic friend sent me this

"A Vedic astrologer explained how the problems to Scorpio and Taurus ascendants would likely be greater in the coming year, due to a massing of slow moving planets in the signs of Aries, Gemini and Libra, with these ascendant either turning the planets into malefics or situating them in a bad house. We can follow promising horoscopes with either of these ascendants, to see if the developments are in some sense unusual, given these transits.

Is it an accident or fate that after Jupiter entered Gemini on June 1, 2013, it seemed that the problems for Egypt increased.
- Egypt got into a tense argument with neighbor Ethiopia over its plans to dam the Nile - the lifeblood of Egypt. President Morsi even threatened to wage war unless the plans were abandoned.
- People in Egypt were upset by President Mursi staffing the Governorships in the country with Moslim Brotherhood loyalists.
The real Vedic astrologers (i.e the old fashioned Jyotishis)

Generally, give Dasa (period-sub period) results with reference to the ascendant and Transits(Gochara) from the Moon sign(not the sun sign or ascendant).This is a big difference.

Gemini is not the fall(or even detriment) of Jupiter in Jyotish.
Actually, Jupiter in Gemini would be casting its full benevolent aspect on planets in Sagittarius,leo and Aries.

This is becoming off topic but

In Jyotish :A detailed Janma Kundali(Horoscope) looks like-

Lots of data and charts then Dasha tables the the predictive part.

First one lists all the good and bad combination of planets to make you a Royal or a pauper.The combination of childhood health scares etc.
Then the house effects followed by,
the dasa effects and end with Transit effect and top it all with the money spinning remedial measures.

PD