A few celebrities

1
http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Fonda,_Henry

http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Hudson,_Rock

http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Monroe,%20Marilyn

Hi
I decided to focus on a few celebritoes whose chart doesnt seem to fit their status,although unfortunately ADB doesnt show Fortuna. Astrotheme does but Im having trouble using that site.
In all these charts the MC or MC ruler appears in a weak position and the only chart where I see something to make up for that is Marilyn Monroe(Sun in 11 Moon and Jupiter in 7 but far from angle). But would that be enough given her overwhelming fame?
Modern Astrolgers would claim her Venus is responsible for her image of sensuality,but as you can see, its out of sect,in detriment,cadent

4
I would discount chart 1 (Fonda)as its only rated C.

http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Help:RR

I will take a look at the other 2 later.

Even a cursory glance shows Monroe does have eminence indicators.

I think the you may be judging eminence using a largely modern mindset ie focusing almost exclusively on the MC. Traditionally, there are many other methods to assess eminence in a chart.

Mark
Last edited by Mark on Mon Jan 14, 2013 7:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

5
Hi Mark
I may have to look at the rules for eminence again but it appears to me about 80% of the population has signs of eminence in their charts.

To make things worse for the rep of Greek astrology ,the most famous translator of Hellenic Astrology,Robert Schmitz,is said to have abandoned his students or something of the sort.

6
Damon,

It's obvious you don't quite know what you're talking about, on either of these subjects. I know you're seeking to know about them, but there's a difference between skeptical inquiry & being rude. Learn the difference.
damon wrote:Hi Mark
I may have to look at the rules for eminence again but it appears to me about 80% of the population has signs of eminence in their charts.

To make things worse for the rep of Greek astrology ,the most famous translator of Hellenic Astrology,Robert Schmitz,is said to have abandoned his students or something of the sort.
Gabe

8
damon wrote:I simply made an observation,I dont think I was rude
For the record, an observation should be based on a fact, not on the idea that you don't see something when others see.

The fact is that these charts (except Fonda's, because of inaccuracy) belong to eminent people. Therefore, eminence should be indicated on their charts. Some of the techniques used by astrologers are actually pointing out the eminence in more than one indication. It is obvious you don't know these techniques, otherwise you would see what we see, don't you think so?

You didn't ask anything, you simply stated what you believe. Again, that is not an observation.
Amor ordinem nescit.
Love does not know order.
- Saint Jerome -

9
No, you have the 10th and MC rulers, the 11th house, the Lots and their lords. I think the chances of anyone person having signs of eminence is pretty reasonable dont you agree?
Monroe had planets in 11 and 7 amongst other things.
As I said ADB doesnt show lots
But people can see what they like

10
Damon wrote:
I may have to look at the rules for eminence again but it appears to me about 80% of the population has signs of eminence in their charts.
What actually do you look for to find eminence in a chart? I am curious. I suspect your 'rules' and mine differ a lot.

damon wrote:
To make things worse for the rep of Greek astrology ,the most famous translator of Hellenic Astrology,Robert Schmitz,is said to have abandoned his students or something of the sort.
What has this random , bizarre comment got to do with anything here? :???:

You put up these charts to discuss eminence/fame. Lets stick to some astrology and leave gossip and personalised accusations about third parties off the forum.

Generally, I am getting the impression you have a problem with hellenistic astrology. Fair enough. Your entitled to your opinion.

You have two choices. Either ignore it completely and stop posting about it or actually take the time to properly study it. However, if you expect your astrological answers to all be a quick fix you will find its not for you.

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

11
See my previous post
I dont expect quick fixes, I think astrology represents only 20% of ourlife,based on experience.
But some people think eminence must always be shown in the chart
As I said theres certainly a lot of people with eminence signs who arent eminent

12
damon wrote:
No, you have the 10th and MC rulers, the 11th house, the Lots and their lords. I think the chances of anyone person having signs of eminence is pretty reasonable dont you agree? Monroe had planets in 11 and 7 amongst other things. As I said ADB doesnt show lots. But people can see what they like
So were you seriously interested in getting a reply or did you just post here to seek to criticise traditional astrology?

I would confess its a bit of a circular argument looking for eminence when we know the person is already famous. However, it is worthwhile checking out traditional theory and comparing it with real lives.

I and many other astrologers are open to the possibility that some traditional eminence techniques may hold up better than others.

However, you have demonstrated contempt prior to investigation. Judging by several of your posts it seems like you may have something of an agenda to undermine traditional astrology. There is a difference between a questioning and an ill informed dismissive attitude.

I am therefore dropping out of this thread with immediate effect.

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly