Nodal Axis on Horizon

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The Nodes standing on the horizon divide the chart sharply. If you allow a 6-degree orb (plus/minus), then this condition will occur in about one in every 30 charts. I do not have any specific "interpretations" for the position. Because of the bi-polar (axial) nature of the Nodes their coincidence with the horizon usually leads me to examine the chart for some sort of division within the life or personality; a duality.

James T. Braha, in his book "Ancient Hindu Astrology for the Modern Western Astrologer" suggest the following for the position (I paraphrase):

Bad for domestic happiness, with many ups and downs. Peaceful or stable periods are short-lived. The marriage partner may be of a spiritual or ascetic leaning -- or devious and deceitful. It is also said to be bad for health, longevity and self-confidence. The ego is enlarged, but the lack of confidence creates an egocentric, self-indulgent, self-important type with no basis for the "pride of self." Oddness and eccentricity are marked. The position is likely an indicator of wealth. There may be an inclination toward the occult, whether for ultimate good or bad depending on other factors. Health problems, if they occur, are more often than not the result of emotional upset or negative thinking. The health problems are hard to diagnose and difficult to cure; diet, natural remedies and such things are the best approach. There is a strong will and physical strength; the native will defeat his enemies or competitors. Supposedly Rahu (the North Node) expresses most strongly in the 42nd year of life.

The Hindu astrologers place a primary emphasis on the Nodes, and their astrology is very much "event-oriented." So there you have the Hindu interpretation of North Node on the Ascendant. I suggest you carefully study the lord of the sign the node is posited in...that should tell you a great deal. The Hindus say that both nodes cause deep and hidden psychological turmoil, and with this point rising it must surely manifest in the persona. [/i]

Nodes and Psychological Turmoil

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Hi Martin -- I used that phrase, "psychological turmoil," perhaps a bit loosely. I do not practice nor study Hindu astrology, have only a passing knowledge of it. Here is a link, apparently written by a Hindu astrologer, and I will quote a few lines from the link here.

http://www.komilla.com/pages/rahu-ketu.html

"As they symbolically eclipse the Sun (consciousness) and the Moon (the Mind), they have a great part to play in darkening our perspective in order to bring in new light."

"Yet their influence is full of potency and spiritual significance. They work in unison 180 degrees apart, two opposite points in the zodiac with a mission to churn our lives in order to externalise hidden potential and wisdom. In keeping with their shadowy nature, they work on a psychological level. It is always difficult to gauge their effect because their main concern is with our emotional makeup. They effect us internally. We are unaware of what exactly is happening to us at the time."

" Rahu Ketu deals with the inner fight within us, the moral and the social choices we have to constantly make and the inner dilemmas."

"They represent the darker side of our nature which we need to overcome. Our inner emotions are like the ocean being churned."

"They can create fear of the unknown. They can create sudden and unexpected results."

"They highlight dissatisfaction within ourselves."


I have underlined certain words and phrases. None say "turmoil," but churning, dissatisfaction, inner warfare (warfare is tumult, turbulence) and so on suggest "turmoil" to me, so I used that word. Hope these extracts from a well-written article will clarify what I meant.

The article is apparently written by a woman astrologer who goes by the name of Komilla. Judging from her easy familiarity and depth of knowledge or true understaning of Rahu/Ketu, as well as her writing style, I judge that she is of Indian descent and cultural background.

Back to Original Question

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My last post, in reply to Martin, Granny....

If you will go to the link (and by the way I had never seen this article before I went searching for authentic Indian information on Rahu Ketu) you will find an excellent article on the meaning and use of the Nodes from the Hindu astrologer's perspective. The Nodes in Hindu astrology have a great deal in common with Pluto as it is used in western astrology, or at least that is my take on it after studying this article.

Anyway, this should shed some light on the North Node conjunct the Ascendant for you. And I also noticed that this article says what I suggested to you -- look to the lord of the sign that the Node is in.

Re: Back to Original Question

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Dave wrote:If you will go to the link (and by the way I had never seen this article before I went searching for authentic Indian information on Rahu Ketu) you will find an excellent article on the meaning and use of the Nodes from the Hindu astrologer's perspective.
No doubt Komilla Sutton is 'authentic Indian', ;) but the psychologized views of the nodes presented in her article are, as far as I can see, her own, and alien to the Indian astrological tradition -- owing much, in fact, to modern western astrology. This, of course, does not mean that she is wrong to hold those views; but it does mean that it would be wrong to generalize about Indian astrology on the basis of her article. (It was the generalization that bothered me in the first place.)

Incidentally, the 'Vedic hymns' quoted in the article (significantly the only quotations given) are certainly not from the Veda, but of medieval or later origin.

Gosh

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Well Martin, as I said I am no student of Hindu astrology. Perhaps it would please you to set me straight, and to answer the original question. Now that you have shown the world how knowledgeable I am not, it is your turn to shine and give Granny some help.

So please, Martin, tell Granny and me, and everyone else who loves to learn...What is the true nature of Rahu Ketu as handed down to us in the original Hindu literature, and what can we expect when Rahu is found at the Ascendant?

Thanks.

Re: Gosh

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Dave wrote:So please, Martin, tell Granny and me, and everyone else who loves to learn...What is the true nature of Rahu Ketu as handed down to us in the original Hindu literature, and what can we expect when Rahu is found at the Ascendant?
Actually, many Sanskrit texts (the older ones in particular) give no particular results for the nodes. But here is one from the Phalad?pik? (8.25): 'When the Serpent [= R?hu] is in the ascendant, [the native will be] short-lived, possessing wealth and strength, [but] afflicted with disease in the upper [part of the] body.'

I wouldn't set too much store by that, myself.

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This may be a bit off topic but during my research on the astrology of comets I have discovered most ancient Indian texts describe comets as Ketu. Although there are noteable exceptions, most comets are described in these texts as malefic. Ketu is often described as the dragon's tail, which gives birth to comets and meteors and is known as the descending or the south node of the Moon. I strongly suspect the south node acquired its malefic, fiery association in Indian astrology by linkage to comets.

Mark
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

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I think you are right, Mark. If I may quote myself (Brill's Encyclopedia of Hinduism, vol. I, entry 'Navagrahas' [the nine planetary deities]):
The ?gveda (5.40.5) tells of a demon named Svarbh?nu afflicting the sun with darkness. In the Atharvaveda (19.9.10), R?hu occurs as a synonym for this demon, while the Ch?ndogya-Upani?ad (8.13.1) speaks of the moon escaping ?from the mouth of R?hu.? Later texts confirm the role of R?hu (perhaps derived from a verb meaning ?to grasp?) as an eclipse demon swallowing the sun or moon.

With the increase of astronomical knowledge, eclipses were understood to be the result of the relative positions of the earth, sun and moon. As the moon passes in front of the sun near the point where their apparent orbits intersect (the lunar node), it obscures the sun and a solar eclipse occurs. When the moon is on the other side of the earth, near the opposite node, the earth?s shadow falling on the moon causes a lunar eclipse. By the early centuries CE, R?hu was thus identified with whichever lunar node happened to be involved in an eclipse. Some astronomical texts speak of the ascending or northern node as R?hu?s mouth, and of the descending or southern node as his tail.

Ketu originally had no connection with R?hu, and was not included with it in the earliest texts of Indianized Hellenistic astrology (3rd to 4th centuries CE). The Sanskrit word ketu refers to something bright, such as a flame, but also to a flag or banner. As such, it was a common word for celestial phenomena such as comets and meteors, more than a hundred of which were described in pre-Hellenistic texts on celestial omens. Eventually these Ketus were included collectively as the ninth item in the list of grahas or planets, but were still discussed in the plural. Only in the 8th or 9th century do the names R?hu and Ketu seem to acquire the meanings which they have since held, being identified with the north and south nodes of the moon, respectively.

On your own...

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Well, Granny....doesn't look like you're getting much help here. If it were me I would go with Komilla. She has repeated what, in essence, I have seen regarding Rahu on other sites that were authentically Indian. And the American astrologer James Braha gave us far more information than we seem to get from the original texts, and he learned his Hindu astrology in India at the feet of masters.

Western astrology, as far as I have seen, does not have much to say about the Nodes.

Reinhold Ebertin suggest that the North Node at the Ascendant deals primarily with personal relationships; unlike the Hindus, he says the conjunction confers an ability to get along with others well. According to him, it brings an innate capacity for teamwork, for finding those who share our interests. When negative, he says it brings estrangements and increasing difficulties among people sharing the same residence.