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Attack on Rudhyar ?
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Nixx



Joined: 10 Dec 2011
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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 2:23 am    Post subject: Attack on Rudhyar ? Reply with quote

I clicked on the Intro to Rudhyar link and found this quote:

''Events do not happen to us, we happen to them.

If a brick falls upon the man's head as he walks along the street, it is the man's responsibility. He walked into the field of the brick's fall. He happened to the brick, because he is a conscious individual and the brick only a piece of universal nature''.

This is an idiotic idea, philosophically speaking, and one wonders if some context has been removed ?
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PiscesSag



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Posted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

He elaborates here.

http://khaldea.com/rudhyar/pofa/pofa_2.shtml
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Chris Brennan



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Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That quote is actually a nice illustration of one of the potential pitfalls of modern humanistic psychological astrology. This notion that the natal chart only represents the psyche of the native, and that transits and such only manifest as external events when the individual doesn't properly deal with their own internal psychic conflicts. In this view the native is so empowered, and potentially has so much control over their own life that if something bad happens to them externally then it is essentially their own fault.

This is something that bothers me about humanistic astrology, because it seems like sometimes by going out of their way to make individuals feel empowered, they end up ignoring the fact that not everything is in under our control. Sometimes if a brick falls out of the sky and hits you in the head it isn't necessarily your fault, and no amount of self-examination is going to give you the Jedi powers that would have been necessary to avoid it.
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waybread



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Posted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris, can you give some specific examples of other modern humanistic astrologers who write that if people had a rough time with a transit, it was their own darn fault?

I gave up on Rhudhyar a while ago, after reading most of his books. He was just too woo-woo for my tastes, and I didn't even think a lot of it made for good astrology. On the other hand, the modern astrologers whom I do admire (like Karen Hamaker-Zondag and the early books by Robert Hand) seem to take a more practical, common-sense approach.

On the surface, the Rudhyar quote is silly. The sensible part of what he seems to be saying (in typical Rudhyarian purple prose,) however, is that part of humans' "contract" for living is that we will, inevitably, occasionally put ourselves in harm's way. We should take responsibility for acknowledging that s*** happens, as part of the admission ticket to Planet Earth, so that we don't have to conceptualize ourselves as victims about life's accidents and misfortunes. I think he's against victimology.

I believe the stoics suggested something similar.

I suppose the real import of some modern psychological astrology is that if you have a rough time with a transit, it is Mom's fault. Citations available upon request.
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Paul
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

waybread wrote:
Chris, can you give some specific examples of other modern humanistic astrologers who write that if people had a rough time with a transit, it was their own darn fault?


I think it's certainly implied in a lot of authors books. If you are having a bad mars transit, then some internalised sense of anger and displacement is somehow projected into the manifest world and you have an accident - this is because you didn't DEAL with your mars properly.

We see this attitude a lot, sometimes it's more overt than others.

Quote:

I believe the stoics suggested something similar.


Yeah I think the stoic philosophy was more like saying, yes, shit can happen, but that doesn't mean you need to feel like shit because of it. It's more a case of cultivating an inner acceptance for reality.
Rudhyar etc. are instead saying shit happens, and it's your fault cos you didn't deal with something or you're not psychologically/spiritually/emotionally evolved enough. I find it odd when people attack traditional astrology for being fatalistic when modern astrology can have something of a history of blaming the victim. Sometimes bricks fall on your head. To take the viewpoint that the entire astroloigcal effect takes place internally in your mind, unless that mind projects it outside itself, suggests that we're gods in our own worlds and all our misfortunes that otherwise might be seen as accidental are in fact our own fault.
I think traditionally astrology was much more liminal. It was in the psyche and the mind, yes, but it was also in the outside manifest world as well.
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Atlantean



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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To the other 300 people that walked down that street, there was no brick for them.

It is naive to think that the brink wasn't meant for the person who received it.

Were it not for this, we would be living in a happenstance world, where things don't happen to us for a particular reason, they happen to us randomly, ie. for no real reason at all.

The second option is infinitely more scary than the first.

Peace

James
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Paul
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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 2:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Atlantean wrote:

It is naive to think that the brink wasn't meant for the person who received it.


The question is probably less to do with whether or not, on some divine scale, the brick is meant to hit the person, the question is more to do with whether or not the brick falls on your head because of you - in whatever way. In other words, had the person been more conscious/spiritual/enlightened/self aware would the brick have not fallen on them?

In other words is it because of the psyche of the individual that the brick falls. This is certainly what Rhudyar is suggesting, but why take this approach? What has consciousness got to do with a brick? If a tree falls in a forest and there's no human consciousness around to fall on, then is it the consciousness of the ants and the birds? Or when accidents happen devoid of human consciousness are they just accidents? But if an accident happens and there's a human being close by, accidents no longer happen but instead the psyche causes it to happen?

Let's extend the analogy further, let's imagine it's no longer a brick, but a car. A car driven by a drunk driver who drives up onto the pavement after losing control of the car and knocks down and injures the person walking along it. Is it naive to think that the car wasn't meant to hit her? And if so is it because of the psyche of the individual who was walking on the pavement?

It begs the question: Can accidents only happen if humans aren't involved?
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Mjacob



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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The problem may be philosophical but it is not astrological. Most people have only heard of natal astrology and not mundane. If bricks fall off buildings it is quite likely to happen in poor countries where maintenance is poor or corruption is rife and landlords bribe the officials. Maybe the national chart could offer a clue.

A couple of examples. A natal chart of a Swiss may indicate military honours for him but the country is neutral so it is unlikely to happen. Has anyone noticed how often mass disasters happen to pilgrims? The ferry to the holy island sinks with all on board drowning. Is it down to bad transits for every individual concerned? Does the Devil rule the world and take perverse pleasure in causing tragedy to the godly. Neither. If you look carefully this kind of thing mostly happens in ramshackle nations with no clue about evacuation drills and enforcing passenger capacity.

If a tree falls in a forest does anyone do its chart to find out why? No it is just bad luck. Same as the brick that falls on your head.

Of course, these kind of events are a boon to chart rectifiers so if it does happen check your watch.

Matthew
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Chris Brennan



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Posted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

waybread wrote:
Chris, can you give some specific examples of other modern humanistic astrologers who write that if people had a rough time with a transit, it was their own darn fault?



It is not so much that this is a rule that is explicitly stated by any modern astrologers, since obviously it sounds kind of harsh when stated in that way, but it is just an observation about the logical conclusion that one could come to if you follow the line of thought that says that transits often manifest as external events when the native doesn't properly deal with them internally. This rule about how transits manifest is mentioned frequently enough in Hand's Planets in Transit that it left an impression on me when was still following my transits with that book every day, although I don't really feel like scouring through it for quotations at the moment. It is just a general observation.
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waybread



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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks, Chris and Paul.

I actually own a boat-load of modern astrology books, and can't think of any that would put the "brick" problem in such stark terms. Of course, it's been a while since I read most of them, so I wondered if you had specific books or astrologers in mind.

I think it is very easy for both traditional and modern western astrologers to criticize one another's chosen work, but sometimes by setting up a straw man.

This "brick" type of thinking was prevalent when I did the old "est" and Landmark forums and workshops ages ago, for about 13 or 14 years. For participants who had been used to construing themselves as victims for various reasons, it actually was empowering for them to realize that they had far more control over their lives than they previously understood.

Where I have seen the idea about manifesting transits come up (and I am embarrased now not to recall the source!) is in the idea that people can learn the empowering and disempowering interpretations of planets, aspects, signs, and houses. For example, Saturn may target us, like Motrin in the TV commercials, "where it hurts". But we can also learn (stoically, I suppose) Saturn's lessons of patience, hard work, getting by on very little, and developing a little gumption in the face of life's adversities.

So if a hard transit of Saturn comes up, ideally, to the extent that we have learned Saturn's "lessons", the transit will not blind-side us. It might not make us joyful, but we'll handle it. To the extent that we expect instant gratification, letting others do the hard work, overspending without consequences, or that life is unfair, a hard Saturn transit might effect us deeply and negatively.

I don't think there's too much that is woo-woo about this. It has a certain element of common sense to it. But this is about day-to-day activities, not the odd unanticipated catastrophe.

Interestingly, I once lived in a newly-purchased old house where the brick chimney (unbeknownst to me) badly needed having the mortar repointed. During a huge thunderstorm, some of the bricks came down in the driveway. Then more bricks fell during the next windy day. We were lucky nobody was hit. However, we had foolishly decided to skip having a contractor or home inspector preview the house before we closed on it. If we had done that, he probably would have caught the problem and we would have fixed it right away.

So some falling bricks are the individual's responsibility!
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Donna Chang



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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chris Brennan wrote:
That quote is actually a nice illustration of one of the potential pitfalls of modern humanistic psychological astrology. This notion that the natal chart only represents the psyche of the native, and that transits and such only manifest as external events when the individual doesn't properly deal with their own internal psychic conflicts. In this view the native is so empowered, and potentially has so much control over their own life that if something bad happens to them externally then it is essentially their own fault.

This is something that bothers me about humanistic astrology, because it seems like sometimes by going out of their way to make individuals feel empowered, they end up ignoring the fact that not everything is in under our control. Sometimes if a brick falls out of the sky and hits you in the head it isn't necessarily your fault, and no amount of self-examination is going to give you the Jedi powers that would have been necessary to avoid it.


Perfectly said, thank you.
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Atlantean



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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Paul,

Re: "The question is probably less to do with whether or not, on some divine scale, the brick is meant to hit the person, the question is more to do with whether or not the brick falls on your head because of you - in whatever way."

Can you explain what you mean, because the difference seems so subtle as to be imperceptible. If the brick is "meant for you", then it IS based on what you have done, else it would not be part of a current lesson.

Re: "In other words, had the person been more conscious/spiritual/enlightened/self aware would the brick have not fallen on them?"

There's no way to have the solution to that question, since we can't see both alternatives at once. Any differences in events between similar charts will be marked up to those differences. In other words, I can't think of an observable way to know the difference. If you have a primary direction involving a malefic and the 3rd House, this often signifies an accident. "An accident" (potentially) covers a lot of ground. Do you bend over to pick up a fallen spoon and throw your back out for 2 weeks forcing you to get the rest you had been neglecting yourself? or are you late for work and in a hurry and cruise through a stop sign only to get t-boned by a trash truck? or are you walking down the street minding your own business when a brick suddenly dislodges and comes crashing down on your head?

Personally, I think that we have certain themes that we are meant to experience (time-wise) otherwise the appropriate primary directions, etc., would not be in effect simultaneously.

Something to contemplate... let's say that (the hypothetical) you were adopted at birth and you never (consciously) knew your Mother. 50 years later, when she dies, it will be very clearly shown in your primary directions even though you never actually knew her and may never find out about the death.

Re: "In other words is it because of the psyche of the individual that the brick falls."

We draw to us the events that we need. Edgar Cayce was also clear on this, we are constantly meeting Self.

The question you seem to be posing is if some adjustment on the part of the "victim" can alter events. Through astrology, we can never really know this, since we can't have two parallel observable futures. Additionally, astrological symbolism carries with it so many layers...so many different levels of experience/events that the symbolism can still play out even though the results are two entirely different levels of occurrence. I personally think that events happen in order to force us to make some statement about ourselves through our reactions (meaning both physical and mental) to those events/themes. They are there for us to learn from... if we are already learning the lesson, we won't need to stay after school. (ie. the brick)

There's still another issue. I feel that I have a very lucky chart. Many dangerous circumstances have been in my life...many times something very terrible-seeming has happened in the short-term, but it has always turned out to be a long-term blessing in disguise. Because of this philosophy, I welcome the brick, it has liberation written on the side of it.

Re: "What has consciousness got to do with a brick?"

I think we just don't see things deeply enough to really understand the full ramifications. Let's (hypothetically) say that unknown to you, your Mother is dying and that you have a lengthy business trip scheduled to begin in a couple of days. Now, with no brick, you go on your business trip and miss your Mother's last moments. Throughout life, you blame yourself that you should have seen the signs...that you would have done anything to be able to be there and share those last moments. Now, in the other scenario, the brick falls, you have an injury and need stitches. The business trip is postponed and because of that, you are close enough to be there as your Mother's time comes to pass. In the short-term, you would side-step that brick if you saw it coming down. If you had any glimpse of the long-term (and your subconscious probably does) then you might likely change your path to get better positioned under the brick.

I don't think anything really happens by accident. Unless you want to modify the meaning of "accident" to mean "something seemingly unforeseeable that is only unforeseeable because we have limited vision into the full ramifications of all elements of our lives, but to one with higher perception, it was totally foreseeable."

Re: "Let's extend the analogy further, let's imagine it's no longer a brick, but a car. A car driven by a drunk driver who drives up onto the pavement after losing control of the car and knocks down and injures the person walking along it. Is it naive to think that the car wasn't meant to hit her?"

If it hits her, then yes it was/is naive to think it wasn't meant to... because if it wasn't meant to, a demolition derby could encircle the pedestrian and there would be nothing to fear.

Re: "And if so is it because of the psyche of the individual who was walking on the pavement?"

Define psyche as you are using it... If "psyche" is inclusive of the Soul's innate understanding of what it needs to learn and how that can come about, then I'd say yes. If you're meaning just what happens to be on the mind in the moment, then I'd say no.

Re: "It begs the question: Can accidents only happen if humans aren't involved?"

That begs an even better question. Is there really such a thing as an accident?

I think not. From a quickly-forgotten paper cut to an assassin's bullet, we constantly meet Self.

In the event of an "accident", don't focus on the WHAT, it will steal your attention away from the WHY. Wink [Astrologers have an advantage...the astrological symbolism will usually stress the why.]

"I can tell you fancy, I can tell you plain...
You give something up for everything you gain...
Since every pleasure has an edge of pain...
Pay for your ticket and don't complain."
- Dylan

Peace

James
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Paul
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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Can you explain what you mean, because the difference seems so subtle as to be imperceptible. If the brick is "meant for you", then it IS based on what you have done, else it would not be part of a current lesson.


Sure, what I mean is that you could have three scenarios, one, Rudhyar's, which is there is a brick, but due to some failing of your own psyche, or due to some law of attraction whereby you attract a falling brick due to your lack of emotional/spiritual/psychological development the brick, which otherwise would have remained stationary falls upon you because on some level it is your fault that it fell.

The second situation is that the brick was always going to fall and by accident you walk under it - it wasn't meant for you, it was just an accident and therefore it falling on you is not really your fault at all.

The third situation is that the brick was always going to fall on you, not because of some failing on your part, it would have fallen on you even if you were entirely spiritually englightened and therefore the brick falling on you is not really your fault at all.

Quote:
There's no way to have the solution to that question, since we can't see both alternatives at once. Any differences in events between similar charts will be marked up to those differences. In other words, I can't think of an observable way to know the difference.


Right, we're forced to be agnostic about the issue. It may be because of some fault of yours, or it may not.

I think the point that was being made here is that Chris sees the assumption that it is due to the individual as being a pitfall of modern astrology. Now in reality modern astrology itself doesn't dictate this approach, rather if it is a pitfall it is one of particular modern astrologers, not necessarily modern astrology.


The potential problem with espousing this kind of thinking is that it essentially blames the victim. If for example the brick falls on the client, and the astrologer explains it's because they didn't OWN that Mars in the 3rd house, but had they owned it then it wouldn't have been a brick falling, it would have been just a few heated words with the neighbours, or whatever else, then it's essentially saying it's your fault this brick fell. If only you had been better, if only you'd been more conscious, more spiritual, more enlightened, more self aware, that brick would not have fallen.

This is fairly innocuous with a brick. But it can easily extend its logic from this basic starting point. If only you had owned that Saturn on the fifth house cusp, that crazy gunman wouldn't have come into your child's school and killed your child. If only you really owned that Venus Pluto square that guy in the club wouldn't have spiked your drink and date raped you. If only you had been a better person, if only you had been more self aware and more spiritually grounded, if only you done or thought something different or been more 'conscious', then these bad things wouldn't have happened. But you weren't self aware enough, and so the brick falls on your head, your child is killed and you're date raped.

If we take the logic that you are responsible for the apparently external events which happen to you, then we can essentially conclude that we're blaming the victim for putting themselves, in whatever occulted way, into victimhood.

But when we know that we have no way of really knowing this from the chart, then we're walking on very dangerous ground that has the potential to be incredibly psychologically damaging.
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Atlantean



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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Paul,

I don't know how "up" you are on Edgar Cayce material, so won't go in that direction, even though I think it could be efficacious in this discussion...

Of course, if someone loses a child to some psycho shooting up the school, then it would be more idiot than astrologer for someone to say it was the parent's or child's "fault." Having something bad happen is different than having something bad happen and having your nose rubbed in it.

Still, I maintain that for that to happen, certain pre-conditions are necessary otherwise it just would not be happening to that particular person. This is a long way away from the idea "you asked for it somehow, so just get over it already." I am fully sympathetic to others' suffering...it's actually the main reason I got into astrology in the first place. However, my philosophical stance is that everything that happens in that life is for that life's growth/development. I believe this is true all the way from getting that dream job all the way down to becoming paraplegic in a scuba dive.

Let's take Christopher Reeve as an example. I believe there were circumstances he needed to find himself in, sympathies he needed to build, internal values that needed to change; which could not, would not have been possible on his previously current path. It became necessary that something happen to make these other things possible. To most, it was a terrible accident that came out of nowhere and left a wonderful person with virtually no control over their own body. To his Soul, it was the first step of many years of important developments. He did many more things for other suffering people while he was a paraplegic than he would ever have done as Superman.

Look at his chart. Pluto on the Ascendant...Uranus at the cusp of the 12th, squaring a Saturn-Neptune conjunction in the 3rd. The potential for a major accident with extreme health repercussions was always possible due to the symbolism. When it, in fact, happens, should we look at it with outrage and question why bad things happen to good people or do we see the strong potential in the birthchart and realize that this was something he needed to experience? (otherwise, it surely wouldn't have happened)

Remember... on the day that he had his fall, it was he who got on the horse. Wink At the same time, I don't think it was possible for him to do otherwise. His fate was awaiting him.

Now, as per this discussion, the question remains, could Christopher Reeve have done something differently? We each have our opinions on this, but we cannot know if he might have been able to mitigate the outcome by having previously learned some of the lessons that he was to ultimately learn. Additionally, he gave a lot of hope to other paraplegics since he had regained some ability long after the incident occurred. If this hope were part of what he was here to impart (he does have Jupiter in the Midheaven after all), then the accident might have been a pre-requisite. [Paraplegics probably wouldn't be so inspired by a fictional character that stops speeding locomotives and can fly, but a handsome, famous, well-off actor that becomes one of them and then still leads a meaningful life and who still gets better through time... how could they not be inspired?]

To me, to think of it as an accident (in the truest sense of the word) would make the event so pointless and hollow. "Oh well, your tough luck, Christopher; I guess we should have named your horse Kryptonite, because it had no trouble bringing down Superman." To instead see it as the beginning of a great unfolding of Christopher's more noble qualities and a new perspective in life and taking up the cause for helping others' suffering, it suddenly makes it something to appreciate, rather than something to fear.

Which feels better to you, Paul? The thought that no matter what you do, when on a horse, random chance might just leave you a paraplegic for basically no reason at all or the thought, if I am too far afield from where my lessons/growth are that "life" will come along and get me back on track for my own long-term benefit, though there might be some heavy short-term consequences?

Interesting discussion, though I feel we are all bound to have very different ideas as to what is True here, based on our own experiences, second, and our own consciousness level, first.

Peace

James
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Paul
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Posted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I don't know how "up" you are on Edgar Cayce material, so won't go in that direction, even though I think it could be efficacious in this discussion...


I know who he is and am familiar with the 'gist' of what he spoke about, but I've not in any way studied him nor even found any compelling reason why I might. I take the attitude that lots of people have mystical insight, and whether or not Cacye is amongst them will be seen in a 'proof is in the pudding' kind of way.

Quote:
Of course, if someone loses a child to some psycho shooting up the school, then it would be more idiot than astrologer for someone to say it was the parent's or child's "fault." Having something bad happen is different than having something bad happen and having your nose rubbed in it.


Right, if the astrologer told them the week before that things happen because of their lack of consciousness, casually explaining about that fallen brick, then the next week, with this new paradigm have taken root in their mind and as they go about their daily business noting the 'bad' things that happen to them and wondering how they can be more conscious owing to how these things are happening because of their lack of self-awareness etc. But then their child dies - events, as she knows, happen because of her own psyche, and wasn't the astrologer just saying last week about potential problems with their children. And didn't she argue with her child the night before and was very frustrated and angry with him, and, ultimately, isn't it all her fault her child is now dead!?
It might sound dramatic, but I don't use these examples as some arbitrary extreme example meant to score a point. This attitude can have real psychological damages and I know of some people who have had terrible events happen in their lives and who blame themselves because of some lack of spiritual awareness or self awareness - they live a life of 'if only' - if only I'd have been more self aware, if only I had owned that planetary energy more, if only I had been a better person.

But really, to my mind, this is an incredibly narcissistic and skewed way of looking at the world - believing that you have these hidden levels of control if only you tap into them. I genuinely believe it can lead to mental dis-ease and mental unhappiness. In my mind it is better to be non-attached to feelings or ideas about being in complete control of your destiny, this attachment to (in my mind) illusions of control leads to anguish and potentially real psychological damage.

Quote:
However, my philosophical stance is that everything that happens in that life is for that life's growth/development. I believe this is true all the way from getting that dream job all the way down to becoming paraplegic in a scuba dive.


To be really clear, I don't mind the idea that "everything happens for a reason", the problem I have is the idea that "bad things happen cos you're not spiritual or psychologically aware enough, and they wouldn't happen if you were a better person".

Quote:
To me, to think of it as an accident (in the truest sense of the word) would make the event so pointless and hollow. "Oh well, your tough luck, Christopher; I guess we should have named your horse Kryptonite, because it had no trouble bringing down Superman." To instead see it as the beginning of a great unfolding of Christopher's more noble qualities and a new perspective in life and taking up the cause for helping others' suffering, it suddenly makes it something to appreciate, rather than something to fear.


Well we can take the same approach either way. It's no less hollow to say "CONGRATULATIONS!! You're now bound to a wheelchair for life, but don't worry, other people will be totes inspired!".
But again it's no better to whisper "eeek, if only you owned that energy more you'd be walking".

Because ultimately as you say, we do not know. And I always think when we don't know something we shouldn't pretend to know something. Maybe he'd be able to walk if he owned that energy more and didn't somehow project it into the manifest world, but then again, maybe not. I think then that when it comes to how we live our lives, we should believe whatever is comfortable for us - be it that bad things happen cos of pure accident, because satan is rampant in your life until you atone for your sins, be it that they happen because of a build up of negative karma in previous lives, or because you weren't spiritual enough.
But when it comes to our role as ambassadors of astrology, I think we should stick to what we can see in a chart because that's what our job is when it boils down to it. At least that's how I see it - whenever I read tarot, or astrology, I see my role as translator. Perhaps this just suits my mercurial nature, I prefer to be amoral and not provide my own "life coaching", I just say what the chart indicates and let them take whatever they want from that and walk away with more information to help them make their own choice. I go to great efforts to not inject my own beliefs, even when others who are more on par with my beliefs open the discussion of it, when it comes to astrology I simply stay silent on those issues. This isn't better or worse, but it may explain my approach to things like this, because really it suits me better to strip away everything but what the chart is showing when it comes to doing astrology.

I had a conversation about horary with a friend of mine and she was appalled at someone at her work place who casually mentioned how awful it was that his sister may be marrying someone of a different caste. Of course it raised an ethical question - in horary astrology when someone of, say, Indian culture asks "Should I marry this man of a lower caste than me? Or will someone better of my own higher caste come along?" do you answer it. This might seem like a tangent, but the point is that my approach to astrology, which I guess is what guides me on issues like what's being discussed here, is to ignore my own personal moral stance on an issue. The querent, if she is genuine, has a real problem on her hands and needs help via a horary reading. Provided the question is not illegal, I take an amoral stance on it, even if it is hard to do that. I remain as detached as possible and whenever anyone asks what my role as astrologer is, I always say translator. It is not up to the translator to choose not to translate certain passages or certain phrases because "they don't like it".

Quote:
Which feels better to you, Paul? The thought that no matter what you do, when on a horse, random chance might just leave you a paraplegic for basically no reason at all or the thought, if I am too far afield from where my lessons/growth are that "life" will come along and get me back on track for my own long-term benefit, though there might be some heavy short-term consequences?


I know what feels worse. Living my life thinking, if only I hadn't been angry with my sister, if only I had spent an hour in silent meditation, if only I had read the right books, if only I had been a better person - if only I had done these things I wouldn't be in a wheelchair (or I wouldn't have been raped, or I wouldn't have a dead child, or I wouldn't have a bump on my head from a fallen brick).
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