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Prince Charles, heir to the throne
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Lunlumo



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 252
Location: Münster, Germany

Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 12:34 pm    Post subject: Prince Charles, heir to the throne Reply with quote



Just an attempt...
Prince Charles - and his Bazi chart.
First impression: lots of water, extremely watery. Thrice in ther Heavenly Branches, thrice in the Earthly Branches. Such an overwhelming amount of one element will doubtless present serious problems. A Yin-water -personality. The more Yin in a man the stronger the desire to get attached to a Yang-woman (and vice versa). One of the reasons why his marriage with Diana went wrong, had to go wrong - probably right from the start, because she, too, was mainly a Yin-individual. People often wondered why he felt more attached to Camilla.
Much, too much (?) water - meaning that sexuality plays a central part in the life (remember those embarrassing yellowpress-stories...)
Too much water may lead to doubts, irrational fears.... And water is additionally strong here, as Charles was born in winter (according to Chinese calendar).
So much cold water - where's the warming fire? Well, one feels tempted to bet that Camilla is more or less a Yang-personality - OR: she has the amount of fire missing in him. Camilla, born 17 July 1947 - indeed: Fire in the Heavenly Stems of the year branch, the month branch and of the day branch (I do not know the time of her birth).
Well, luckily there's some earth - to give a certain structure and direction to those flowing masses of water.
No metal, nowhere. Usually a clear hint that one needs encouragement, one might lack self-respect as well as ambition. However, in this case the lack of metal is something not to worry about too much. If there was metal it would produce even more water thus doing damage to the stabilizing earth given in this chart.
As to the earth branches: twice pig plus rabbit - diplomacy plus the "I'm OK - you're OK" - attitude.
Well, there's certainly a lot more one might say about him.
LL
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Deb
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Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2012 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting. Thanks for this. Nice how you incorporated the tabulated details.
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Lunlumo



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
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Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2012 8:25 am    Post subject: Na Yin and partnership Reply with quote

Thanks, Deb.
Let me add some more observations - concerning partnership, in this case Charles and Diana .

Every pillar is comprise of a Heavenly Stem and an Earthly Branch. The so-called Na Yin Element is the product element as a result of the pairing up of the Heavenly Stem and Earthly Branch ( NaYin = "Five Melodic Elements"). The element resulting from this pairing might, at times, turn out to be completely different. For example, when Wood and Water combines, the resulting Na Yin element turns out to be Metal.
See here:

http://www.pp.htv.fi/ivilkki/Na_Yin.html

In that link above you can quickly find the Na Yin - Element for the year-pillar (the one on the right). The Na Yin Element can howver, be found for the other three pillars as well.
When people say that Charles is a "Rat" and Diana was a "Sheep (or "Goat") they usually refer to the year pillar often without knowing that there are three more. They should at least add the corresponding Heavenly Stem of that pillar which is equally important, providing the basis for the Earth Branch.)
However, it is the day pillar that marks the inidviduality. It may be said to "rule" the complete chart. All the changes going on refer to the day pillar.
The year pillar gives an insight into the traditions (duties, responsibilities...) that we have inherited from our grandparents and our "ancestors" (roughly speaking...)

By comparing the Na Yin elements of the day pillars you may find out about the basics of a partnership. This works well and can usually be relied on.
E.g. Charles and Diana:
Charles - day pillar: Heavenly Stem is Yin Water, Erthly Branch is Rabbit which is Yin-Wood. The resulting Na Yin element is "Golden mirror, golden decoration" - (which tells us that a great emphasis is put on one's own appearance - may appreciate "luxury") . The Na Yin element is weak metal (note that "weak" here does not imply a negative meaning).

Diana - day pillar: Heavenly Stem Yin-Wood, Earthly Branch Sheep which is Yin-Earth. The Na Yin element is "Gold at the bottom of the sea" - i.e. the Na Yin element is metal.
So both, Charles and Diana had the same Na Yin Element - metal.

The consequenmces for their marriage:
Metal shines - especially gold. But with both partners having this element it will also mean fighting and arguing, if not rows. The beginning will or at least may be a good and happy one - the end as a rule will be unhappiness. Things might be different with a lot of fire in one of the charts. Unlike Charles's chart Diana's showed some fire - Horse/Yang-Fire in the month pillar. But it did not suffice to bring about the necessary change.

Camilla's day pillar: Heavenly Stem is Yin-Fire / Rooster.
The corresponding Na Yin element: "Fire at the slope or at the foot of the mountain". Strong Fire.

So Charles/Camilla: (weak) Metal - (strong) Fire. This will mean that the wife's fire will prevail over the husband's metal. Which, however does not mean unhappiness resulting - providing the male partner will "yield" to this. In this case metal will be melted and transformed into something "valuable". Then (only then) happiness will be achieved.

However, the Na Yin elements, when referred to relationships, should be regarded within the context of the complete charts and what they reveal about the interaction of the elements. This is more intricatethan one might think at first glance. As I mentioned above: had there been more fire in Diana's chart the marriage would probably have led to better results.
LL
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Lunlumo



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
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Posted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Let me add some more hints...A lot has been said abot Charles's behaviour to Diana - and for the greater part it was him who was blamed.
However, his chart reveals that one shouldn't be too quick when it comes to stating responsibilities.
As mentioned before, it is the Day Pillar that represents the personality.
We find the Heavenly Stem Yin- Water there (or just "10") and the Earth Branch Rabbit (or just "IV").
In the Day Pillar one's partner is represented by the Branch - in this case Rabbit. Well, we remember that Diana loved children and knew how to take care of them (you find Rabbit in her Hour Pillar).
Rabbit is connected with the element Yin Wood. The element Wood is supported by Water. In other words Charles can't have been a bad husband from the start - this is a strong hint that at least for some time he must have given her the support she expected.
Another look at Charles's Day Pillar: Its Qi-phase is "Growth and flourishing" (changsheng) - Among others its implications are that one is not willing to accept a subordinate position. There can't be the slightest doubt that Charles is willing to be King one day.

LL
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jorge



Joined: 13 Mar 2012
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Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lunlumo wrote:
Let me add some more hints...A lot has been said abot Charles's behaviour to Diana - and for the greater part it was him who was blamed.
However, his chart reveals that one shouldn't be too quick when it comes to stating responsibilities.
As mentioned before, it is the Day Pillar that represents the personality.
We find the Heavenly Stem Yin- Water there (or just "10") and the Earth Branch Rabbit (or just "IV").
In the Day Pillar one's partner is represented by the Branch - in this case Rabbit. Well, we remember that Diana loved children and knew how to take care of them (you find Rabbit in her Hour Pillar).
Rabbit is connected with the element Yin Wood. The element Wood is supported by Water. In other words Charles can't have been a bad husband from the start - this is a strong hint that at least for some time he must have given her the support she expected.
Another look at Charles's Day Pillar: Its Qi-phase is "Growth and flourishing" (changsheng) - Among others its implications are that one is not willing to accept a subordinate position. There can't be the slightest doubt that Charles is willing to be King one day.

LL


Interesting reading. my teacher believes Charles is a follow leader,meaning ,Earth or power is unfavorable.
See the link "download FP of celebrities.

http://www.astro-fengshui.com/astrology/four_pillars.html

My own chart is tricky.Too much eart expression element with no control from Wood. Might be another FL. It`s all Yin and I`m particularly drawn to Yang athletic women

hour day month year
Yin fire yin fire yin metal yin metal
Sheep Sheep Ox Ox

Strauss Kahn is a good example. He is a Follow type with too much woman/wealth element and the poor man can`t control himself when he sees a skirt

Jorge


Last edited by jorge on Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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jorge



Joined: 13 Mar 2012
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Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is another system,Zi Wei Dou Chu,which uses 12 houses like Tropical astrology.
Here are some links for learning.
You can get your chart here
www.destinyandluck.com

http://zwdsastrology.blogspot.com/search?updated-min=2010-01-01T00%3A00%3A00Z&updated-max=2011-01-01T00%3A00%3A00Z&max-results=25


http://astropalais.forumculture.net/t132p12-zwds-superfate-intro-afinity-12-palaces-stories-stars-of-108-suite
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Lunlumo



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
Posts: 252
Location: Münster, Germany

Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 9:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Jorge,
thanks for these links - Very Happy
it was a good idea to start a Chinese forum here. However, one might have expected some more response... well, that may change.

Zi Wei Dou Chu - certainly most interesting. As to me, I feel that Bazi Suanming itself is a most complex system - as I mentioned above much more complex than people might assume at first sight. And I think it can speak for itself. Nevertheless, it will be interesting to study Zi Wei Dou Chu.
Your chart: What we see is a double Fuyin - Fuyin meaning duplication of a pillar. And in addition: the Fuyin charts are neighbours. - However, this thread has so far dealt with Charles. One might discuss this in another chart (?).
Another look at Charles's chart: His present Ten Years' cycle (age 58-67) is partly unfavouarable. It is Yin Earth in the Stems and Snake in the Branches. Yin Earth is definitely unfavourable for Yin Water - Charles's Stem in the Day Pillar. As a rule during the first half of a decade the Stem prevails, whereas the Branch is in charge in the second half - the latter one providing more positive influences for him.
He could handle more or less successfully the problems he doubtlessly was confronted with due to Snake in the Earthly Branch - that goes well together with the Eartlhy Branch of his Day Pillar.

His forthcoming Ten Years' Cycle ( starting when he'll be 68 ) will on the whole be more favourable: Yang Metal and Horse. As the Heavenly Stem is more important during the first five years we may say that the second half of this decade will turn out to be a successful period. Things will be more difficult in the second half when Horse will take over - possibly a clash with his Earth Branch in the Day Pillar.

LL
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Last edited by Lunlumo on Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:04 am; edited 2 times in total
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jorge



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Posted: Tue Mar 13, 2012 10:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks
Normally in a strong chart like his, Earth would be Fav, cause it blocks water, but not in this case,as it combines with Gui,and besides,Earth has no root in the chart. If he becomes King, his Power will just be in the eyes of the beholder. He`ll be ruled by others behind the scenes. Power without root is like a Tree with no roots. Impossible to survive
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Lunlumo



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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 6:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for this additional information - very important indeed.
- Being King in Britain means being reduced to purely symbolical
functions.
I wonder in which way his masses of Water would get along with the
chart of Britain. - But so far I have not really tried to analyse mundane Bazi charts. And I've actually never come across any (no idea why not...) One of the problems arising when one wants to have a look at the Cycles : Is a state "male" or "female" or "female"?

LL
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golmagi



Joined: 07 Mar 2012
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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lunlumo wrote:
.

His forthcoming Ten Years' Cycle ( starting when he'll be 68 ) will on the whole be more favourable: Yang Metal and Horse. As the Heavenly Stem is more important during the first five years we may say that the second half of this decade will turn out to be a successful period. Things will be more difficult in the second half when Horse will take over - possibly a clash with his Earth Branch in the Day Pillar.

LL


If the cycle is favourable, do you think it equals good things for the nation or will it be strictly personal? After all, the fate of the monarch is intertwined with the fate of the nation.
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jorge



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Posted: Wed Mar 14, 2012 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lunlumo wrote:
Thanks for this additional information - very important indeed.
- Being King in Britain means being reduced to purely symbolical
functions.
I wonder in which way his masses of Water would get along with the
chart of Britain. - But so far I have not really tried to analyse mundane Bazi charts. And I've actually never come across any (no idea why not...) One of the problems arising when one wants to have a look at the Cycles : Is a state "male" or "female" or "female"?

LL

Hi
I wonder why prof. Goertzt says 3 of the same god is unfavorable,but 4,as long as spread across the 4Pillars,is favorable. It´s the first time I read that. I happen to have 4 Genussgeist(eating god) in my 4p

thanks
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Lunlumo



Joined: 04 Sep 2007
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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[/quote]
Hi
I wonder why prof. Goertzt says 3 of the same god is unfavorable,but 4,as long as spread across the 4Pillars,is favorable. It´s the first time I read that. I happen to have 4 Genussgeist(eating god) in my 4p

[/quote]

Hmm, strange indeed. Actually I'm more or less a beginner...
I'll check that in Görtz's book. By the way, it should have been published more carefully - lots of misprints. For the greater part they don't really matter - but some are really serious. For corrections see here:
http://www.bazi-suanming-praxis.info/?page_id=2

LL
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jorge



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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 12:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lunlumo wrote:

Hi
I wonder why prof. Goertzt says 3 of the same god is unfavorable,but 4,as long as spread across the 4Pillars,is favorable. It´s the first time I read that. I happen to have 4 Genussgeist(eating god) in my 4p

[/quote]

Hmm, strange indeed. Actually I'm more or less a beginner...
I'll check that in Görtz's book. By the way, it should have been published more carefully - lots of misprints. For the greater part they don't really matter - but some are really serious. For corrections see here:
http://www.bazi-suanming-praxis.info/?page_id=2

LL[/quote]

I asked him.Here is the reply:

it is the case that one appearance is good oder bad depending on the question weather or not the element is operative or not. Two times or three times increases the importance and four times in all four pillars mean the opposite. Its in Bazi Suanming the case, that very much and very little have the same meaning.

e.g. I know an quiet attractive lady with RN (Pian Cai) in all 4 pillars. With 3 she would go for a luxurious life, ready to spend her body for high money. With 4 pillars she has high moral, and regular sense for luxus.

Regards
Horst

As for me I`m not a beginner but like so many, I stopped learning from Joseph Yu cause he lives in the West but wants to force Chinese ways on us,that is, we cannot question the teachers knowledge and authority. He pretended to be open, but when real rersearch began, it became taboo in his centre
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Lunlumo



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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[/quote]

If the cycle is favourable, do you think it equals good things for the nation or will it be strictly personal? After all, the fate of the monarch is intertwined with the fate of the nation.[/quote]

Well, in the case of Britain I wouldn't go that far. Take Elizabeth II - an embodiment of tradition etc - a woman who deserves respect and obviously has always received it - but all this could not stop her country from continually declining ("We won the war, we lost the peace." etc.).
LL
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jorge



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Posted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lunlumo wrote:


If the cycle is favourable, do you think it equals good things for the nation or will it be strictly personal? After all, the fate of the monarch is intertwined with the fate of the nation.[/quote]

Well, in the case of Britain I wouldn't go that far. Take Elizabeth II - an embodiment of tradition etc - a woman who deserves respect and obviously has always received it - but all this could not stop her country from continually declining ("We won the war, we lost the peace." etc.).
LL[/quote]

The prime minister`s chart is more likely to affect the nation.
With Charles as King they may just get fewer tourists than when William becomes King
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