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English Riots
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Mark
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Posted: Mon Aug 08, 2011 10:57 pm    Post subject: English Riots Reply with quote



London, England has seen its 3rd night of rioting in parts of the city. Baton-wielding Police officers have fought running battles with hooded youths as violence swept the streets of London. In many locations Police seem to have been overwhelmed by the scale of the level of civil disturbances. Not since the blitz in WWII has no much of London been on fire. All this in what will be the Olympic city of 2012. In copy cat actions riots have now spread across England's major cities.

Background

The initial rioting occurred in Tottenham in North London on Saturday night and spread to Brixton in south London the following evening. The violence spread still further on Monday night. Cars and buildings were torched and shops looted in at least six areas of the capital, repeating the lawless scenes of Tottenham and Brixton at the weekend. The violence has now spread to other British cities such as Birmingham, Manchester Liverpoool, Nottingham and Bristol.

Disturbances first broke out late on Saturday night in Tottenham and the surrounding area after the killing of Mark Duggan, 29 and a father-of-four, by armed police in an attempted arrest on August 4.

As PM David Cameron and London Mayor Boris Johnson both finally cut short their foreign holidays to deal with the crisis, the trouble seemed to spread like wildfire across the capital and beyond.

Just how this incident sparked such a dramatic reaction is already the subject of considerable political discussion. As with most rioting the vast majority of the violence that followed was opportunist looting and property destruction. Hundreds of millions of pounds of property and businesses have been lost. What perhaps makes this outbreak different is the initial reports that technology such as Blackberry phones and Tweeting have been used to coordinate rioting.

Traditional vs Modern perspective

In trying to analyse such occurrences modern astrology often gives central focus to an event chart. However, traditional astrology looks for various charts that the event could stem from. From a traditional perspective an event chart is quite meaningless unless it is presented in the context of other charts it would be seen to stem from. In the long term we might look at Jupiter-Saturn conjunctions , foundational elected and ingress charts, eclipse and seasonal ingress charts. Bringing things down to the short term we have lunation charts. The logic of the latter stems back to Ptolemy and other early astrologers who suggested all events on earth in the ‘sub-lunar realm’ are mediated through the Moon and its lunations.

The Event Chart

Of course we can seek to probe the event chart for the outbreak of these riots. According to BBC Press reports the riots first broke out in Tottenham at 22:20 on Saturday night.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_London_riots

Here is the chart:



Reflecting the the Aries Ingress the ASC and MC of this chart are ruled by malefics. The ASC is Mars ruled with Mars in fall in Cancer conjunct the IC and opposing Pluto angular on the MC. The IC traditionaly represents the government's opponents and here Mars is conjunct it with Moon in Scorpio dispositing it. The Mars type atmosphere is also reflected in the public mood by the Moon in fall in Scorpio disposited by Mars in Cancer. Both planets form a 'generosity' although not a desirable one with both planets in fall!

The Pre-lunation Chart

Interesting though I think its more interesting and relevant to study the pre-lunation chart of July 30th. Pre-lunation ie new or full moon charts preceding an event like this have one immense advantage over any event chart. They offer the possibility of realistic prediction in mundane astrology. One of the major failings of modern mundane astrology is that it seldom approaches prediction in a strucured way. This is unsurprising as long as we spend our time picking over event charts. They may be interesting but if we want to move from retrospective to predictive astrology I think we need to change our approach.



Looking at the pre lunation chart itself we see the lunation occured in the 8th house by WS houses symbolizing loss and distress. By Quadrant the luminaries are angular opposing the ascendant. The malefics rule both key angles of the chart ( ASC +MC). Mars is the MC ruler and ruler of the 4th house by whole sign. It is located in the 6th house (the house of slaves, serfs and by modern association the underclass). Jupiter is Lord 12 and square the luminaries. Saturn is in the 10th house by WS. The new moon at 7 Leo occurred exactly on the malefic nebula known as Praesaepe or the bee hive which is right on the ecliptic. According to Ptolemy this nebula was of the nature of Mars and the Moon. As public disorder rioting seems well reflected in a Moon-Mars connection. Plus the scene of angry rioters ‘swarming’ in numbers and ‘buzzing’ on their phones and internet technology seems very apt in this context to the imagery. This is also reflected by Mars in communicative sign of Gemini.

Aries Ingress and Pre-lunation Chart

Again though to make it more significant we can study it in reference to the Aries Ingress chart for 2011. As the rising sign was fixed in this chart it has application for the whole year. This is just one event and I don’t expect it to pick up multiple triggers in a chart. We dont need it to. All we really need is one very clear indicator.

I have created a Bi-Wheel with the Aries Ingress chart in the middle and the pre-lunation chart of the outer ring. It is clear that the Mars ( symbolizing violence, and conflict) is closely conjunct the South Node of the Aries Ingress chart.



With Scorpio rising Mars is Lord 1 but we see it in the 8th house, the house of loss, fear and distress.

Pre-lunation and United Kingdom National chart (1927)

Although national charts are controversial and criticized by some traditionalists they undoubtably have their uses. Especially when we have an unambiguous, timed chart. Equally, for many nations like the modern United Kingdom there is no clear cut date from which we can date a foundational ingress.

I have long been a supporter of the 1927 chart for the modern United Kingdom. As I have pointed out many times here on the forum the late Maurice McCann researched the history of this subject and demonstrated conclusively that the modern state of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland only actually formally began in 1927. Comparing the pre-lunation chart we observe that Mars is in partile conjunction to the Mars of the 1927 chart! Mars is Lord 12 in that chart highlighting the self destructive effect of such outbreaks for both the nation and local communities.


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Last edited by Mark on Tue May 22, 2012 11:03 pm; edited 4 times in total
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daz madrigal



Joined: 09 Jun 2006
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Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 10:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MARK DUGGAN SHOOTING

Trigger for the London Riots August 2011



Quote:
A police marksman escaped with his life when a bullet lodged in his radio during the confrontation that ended in the death of Mark Duggan, 29. The Scotland Yard firearms officer was taken to hospital and later released.

The Independent Police Complaints Commission, which is investigating the fatal shooting, said the bullet and a non-police-issue handgun found at the scene had been sent for forensic tests.

IPCC investigators believe two shots were fired by an armed officer. A spokesman for the IPCC said that at around 6.15pm on Thursday officers from Operation Trident,


Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/aug/05/man-shot-police-london-arrest







Haven't had any time to interpret but obviously the #Mar opp #Plu across ASC/DC is extremely conflictive & would be the type of powder keg trigger one would expect to see. Wouldnt be at all surprised if the #Mar#Can was exactly on DC rather than 2 degree's away.

#Mar sabian at 1#Can is always seen as a Turning Point I cannot emphasis that too much! Its the first Cardinal point to be revealed after the Revelation of 1st Aries. Its a point of ACTION.

here is #Mar sabian for 1#Can

#Mar__CANCER 1°): ON A SHIP THE SAILORS LOWER AN OLD FLAG AND RAISE A NEW ONE.

KEYNOTE: A radical change of allegiance exteriorized in a symbolical act: a point of no return.

We have now reached a square (go-degree angle) to the beginning of the cyclic process. This is a moment of crisis, a sharp turning point. In the zodiacal cycle, at the summer solstice the northward motion of the sun (in "decimation") stops; the sun rises and sets as far north of exact east and west as it can during the year-cycle. Its motion is now reversed. Slowly the sunset points move southward on the western horizon, and the length of the day decreases. In the lunation cycle (from New Moon to New Moon) this is the First Quarter phase. On the "ship" which symbolizes the ego-consciousness floating, as it were, on the sea of the vast Unconscious, the individualized will makes a basic decision. The dominant Yang force allows the Yin force to begin its six-month long rise to power. The "collective" will gradually overcomes the "individual," and at the end the state will overpower the person. Now, however, the individual person enjoys his most glorious hour; he exults in his ability to make a "free decision"- i.e. to act as an individual who selects his life goal and his allegiance.



The symbol is simple and to my mind extremely apt for the situation at hand, one stark image acts as a metaphor.. I personally see this image as hoisting a pirate flag and taking down the traditional Union flag of Law & Order.

..and what was the primary aim....to LOOT.




greg
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Last edited by daz madrigal on Tue Aug 09, 2011 11:41 am; edited 1 time in total
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pankajdubey



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Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 10:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

These riots are very close to the Saturn in Libra riots of Brixton in 1981.
Both have a racial trigger that subsequently degenrates in to looting and firing.


PD
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daz madrigal



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Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Interesting though I think its more interesting and relevant to study the pre-lunation chart of July 30th. Pre-lunation ie new or full moon charts precding an event like this have one immense advantage over any event chart. They offer the possibility of realistic prediction in mundane astrology. One of the major failings of modern mundane astrology is that it seldom approaches prediction in a strucured way. This is unsurprising as long as we spend our time picking over event charts. They may be interesting but if we want to move from retrospective to predictive astrology I think we need to change our approach.



I'm not sure that an astrologer would see particularly great danger in the pre-lunation chart by itself. Cap asc with its saturn ruler square has an ominous air riding high in the chart but there is nothing unusual about that and it wouldnt cause alarm by itself. I agree about Mars on 6th cusp but again its only with hindsight that we'd make the conclusion of a sudden uprising of servants/underclasses etc. I think we need something extra, I'm not sure what..fixed stars? previous volatile aspects carried on from the past? Certainly Mars has been unusually prolific in its mayhem this year, could that be a vestige of the much talked about conjunction with Pluto in Cap alongside 4 other planets?

The immediate question is how long will these riots last for? Again that is hard to judge despite us now having all the facts in front of us. Looking at it quite simply the five degree point marks a change of tone and so on that basis we should see a cessation of violence by Aug 11th.
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daz madrigal



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Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 11:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pankajdubey wrote:
These riots are very close to the Saturn in Libra riots of Brixton in 1981.
Both have a racial trigger that subsequently degenrates in to looting and firing.


PD



The shooting was quite controversial with the Police claiming they were acting in self-defence after Mark Duggan initially shot at a policeman. With Mercury retrograde in 8th I wonder how much credence we can give that information. Enough grounds to suspect a deliberate muddyng of the waters?


G
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Eddy



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Posted: Tue Aug 09, 2011 2:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a look at the eclipse charts for 4 january 2011 (solar) and 15 june 2011 (lunar) because these had the eclipse on the horizon in England (and in Norway as discussed in the Oslo thread). Here some thoughts.

For the ecliptical conjunction/opposition point of the eclipses the 15 June in Tottenham gives an exact alignment with the Asc/Desc axis. (The 4 january eclipse is already quite along in XII house).

Greg's chart of the shooting gives almost the same ascendant point and Mars not so close but still near the Descendant. I didn't see other significant transits in relation to the eclipses. Saturn of the event is one degree before the square to the 4 january eclipse point. But Moon having passed Saturn conjunct may have already triggered it.

Looking at the planetary symbolism: If of these given positions Mars is the most significant then it indicates the violence. If Saturn might be most significant, then the troubles might last a long while, like tensions under the surface.

The eclipses are a bit confusing. The 4 january solar eclipse fits more the relation to Duggan while the 15 june lunar eclipse took place exact on the horizon, and appears more relevant.

If the birth date is correct http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Mark_Duggan , then Duggan's noon chart has Moon in 10 Aries in opposition to natal Saturn in Libra, Jupiter and Mercury in 14 and 17 Libra respectively. Natal Sun was square with Neptune and progressed Sun is sextile to Neptune. Maybe not significant but I didn't find much more (progressed Sun one degree before conjunct Pluto). These Sun-Neptune issues could indicate the relationship to drugs, whether alleged or real.
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MikeCoop



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Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 9:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi, stripping things right down, Mars formed a T-square with Uranus and Pluto in the event chart, with the lunar transit "joining the dots". IN "COSI" for Mars/Uranus/Pluto we have "Fanaticism, an act of violence, the mania of destruction..." I think on the broader setting interactions with the lunar nodes are "Scene setting " too. For a while Plutonian "monsters" are "on the loose" both in politics and in a more specific setting with Pluto's recent conjunction to the North node and its continuing "rise" above the nodal axis. Mars , in turn crossed that axis in Gemini and we had the terrible terrible fanatic attacks on innocent children in Norway. Now Mars continues to "sink below" the nodal axis to reach its current position in the T-square, aggravating the Uranus?pluto square with its "acts of violence, upsets, and subversive activities" (from Ebertin again).

I feel it pertinent that Mars crossed the south node to make its aspect. Down at the south end its all about the making us ALL "victims" and less about the "perpetrators" if that makes sense. Both Norway and here in the UK there is precious little talk of personal motive and more the general social outrage and determination to fight back as a community.

mike c
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daz madrigal



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Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think we can now pin the current events down to a few specific areas and trigger points.

1) 0-10 Cardinal Signs

This has already been covered by everyone here, #Mar#Ura#Plu is a volatile mix.  At the time the riot started Pluto was at the Midheaven starkly bringing up repressed & long buried resentments. Now is the time for the powder keg to erupt.

With this intensely volatile t-sq's interaction to the 1801 chart it has to be a mystery as to the precise reasons it wasn't red-flagged by astrologers beforehand.



2) #Sat#Nod in #Lib ASC - 1801 Chart

Quote:
Brady writes of the South Node as:

… a place where we do not feel comfortable because we do not control it. It is the gate through which things can crash into our world, unplanned, uncontrolled, unscheduled and definitely unintentional. So the achievement or gains made in this place are by accident rather than design. It is a gateway to a territory which offers us confusion rather than adventure.


Any planet closely conjunct SN warns of a potential catastrophe - arising out of the blue - and much moreso when a malefic is involved. In Norway it was the #Mar/SN...simarly we now have #Sat/SN afflicting the UK.


3) #Mer RX opp #Nep#Aqu/#Pis

Exact during the confusing events surrounding the Mark Duggan shooting, the deception and misunderstandings resulting from this trigger exist throughout the entire week and beyond. The UK Police are unable to get a grip, the politicians are either absent or muddle-headed, the fire service is either held back or ineffective..all typical examples of a retrograde #Mer afflicted by the crippling   indecision  of #Nep.

As with the Norway killings, the innocents at the scene invariably describe the unfolding scene as strangely illusory, as if in a dream. It difficult to ascribe such events to reality.


Those seem to be the obvious factors...other more minor influences would apply ofcourse.



greg
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daz madrigal



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Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The Event Chart

Of course we can seek to probe the event chart for the outbreak of these riots. According to BBC Press reports the riots first broke out in Tottenham at 22:20 on Saturday night.



Mark

The 22.20 chart is probably more accurate than the 22.30 chart on display as malefic Mars and Saturn are sitting directly on the angles.

Slightly more scary in my view.


G
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MikeCoop



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Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi again, I'm very struck by the thought that with the Norwegian massacre children were the victims of atggression under Gemini . With the move to Cancer children have become Martial aggtressors themselves, against a backdrop of lack of broken families
mike c
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Mark
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Posted: Wed Aug 10, 2011 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The 22.20 chart is probably more accurate than the 22.30 chart on display as malefic Mars and Saturn are sitting directly on the angles.


Hi Greg,

I will happily change it if you can find me a source. Smile Wikipedia seems quite unreliable. For example it cites the Tottenham post office being set on fire at 22:15 on Saturday the 6th. However, when you check the newspaper source this is linked to it states this occured at 11.15pm!

Mark
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pankajdubey



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Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mark wrote:
Quote:
The 22.20 chart is probably more accurate than the 22.30 chart on display as malefic Mars and Saturn are sitting directly on the angles.


Hi Greg,

I will happily change it if you can find me a source. Smile Wikipedia seems quite unreliable. For example it cites the Tottenham post office being set on fire at 22:15 on Saturday the 6th. However, when you check the newspaper source this is linked to it states this occured at 11.15pm!

Mark


..and this could be the same time- 22.15 GMT and 23.15 BST Smile


There must be a sensitive point in the chart of England which has recently been triggerd.

News of the World,The Met and now the rioting in England have stripped the fabric and laid bare for all to feed the monster of secret messaging and hacking at the same time, those hunting for scopps were scooped and everyones grief played on you tube satisfying our appetite for voyuerism and twittering titter.It has burned the pillars of democarcy in a relatively tolerant society. It is mainly England not so much the Union as Scotland , Wales and NI have largely been untouched.

A look at Lilly's Fire of London and the 1780 riots may be worthwhile.Something in early degrees of Libra perhaps has some relation to England- Jupiter in LIbra in 1780 fanning the religious divide and Saturn in Libra - triggering the racial black and white schism.England , I understand is natural Aries.

India with natural Capricorn is also suffering from one scam after another and Australia with Libra prominent in many of its charts has had its share of unsettling events.



PD
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Wolfgang



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Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mundane astrology is actually a "simple" thing, if you follow the ancients.

Going out of the Capricorn (2010) and Aries (2011) horoscope of the year which is calculated on the capital of the State concerned, you can do good statements, by the planetary positions each other and also by position in the various houses. In Additional also the eclipse horoscopes of this year, which show some more.

In addition to the previous statements I would like to make it to the attention that the preceding lunar eclipse expected on London, this was exactly on the Ascendent. (24 ° Sag.) Also in the interpretation according to the ancients, the lunar eclipse in Sagittarius means on thefts and robberies in the country and suggesting means to all sorts of evil for the population.
Also the right readings of the Ingress Capricorn and Aries (position in the houses) will give good forecast for the country!

Wolfgang
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Mark
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Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
..and this could be the same time- 22.15 GMT and 23.15 BST


I dont think so. The source I referred to was the UK Sun newspaper which will not be listing times in GMT. The burning of the Post office was clearly a later development.

Mark
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Mark
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Posted: Thu Aug 11, 2011 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wolgang wrote:
Quote:
Going out of the Capricorn (2010) and Aries (2011) horoscope of the year which is calculated on the capital of the State concerned, you can do good statements, by the planetary positions each other and also by position in the various houses. In Additional also the eclipse horoscopes of this year, which show some more.


I am not sure about the previous Capricorn ingress still being operative. However, I agree with everything else you said. I have been hoping to post about this for days but been too busy.

Mark
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Last edited by Mark on Thu Aug 11, 2011 10:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
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