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How does astrology work ?
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jamesj



Joined: 15 Jun 2011
Posts: 1
Location: USA

Posted: Wed Jun 15, 2011 3:53 pm    Post subject: How does astrology work ? Reply with quote

can anyone explain how does astrology work ?
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Tara



Joined: 26 Apr 2006
Posts: 450

Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 2:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi James,

Read this: http://www.skyscript.co.uk/doctrineofsignatures.html

Cheers,
Tara
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Richard Vetter



Joined: 03 May 2008
Posts: 54
Location: Offenburg, Germany

Posted: Thu Jun 16, 2011 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

or this: http://astroinfo.astrologix.de/erkennt/subjPro/subjProGB.htm

Richard
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SGFoxe



Joined: 13 Apr 2006
Posts: 200
Location: Chicago, IL

Posted: Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been thinking about this lately.

The Primus Mobile is of course the Terrestial Axis of Rotation ... this is what determines day & night hour given its relationship to the sun, its barycentric revolution with the Lunar Axis of Rotation determines the monthly cycle along with their revolution about the sun the year. Also the TAR's 26K year wobble the Precessional Cycle a/k/a Platonic Great Year.

the TAR is the active principal of TIME -- TIME is Geocentric!!

Other planets even in our system, potentially create their own temporal rhythms...

Time as we know it is a Terrestial Dimension.

Given the great Wobble of the Precessional Cycle, there are small cycles, three and seven years alternating which were discovered in the early 20th Century called the Chandler Wobble ...

As I see it, it is a Pardigm of the Ptolemaic orbits of earth -- it is hypothesized (by me) that the Chandler Wobble is caused by the various forces, gravitational, magnetic, &c. effects of the other orbiting members of the Solar System

The Ptolemaic weltanschuuang, except that the earth rotates, is a valid picture of the TEMPORAL universe ... time centered universe, while the heliocentric view is a spatial picture.

The astrological effects of the planets are mediated by the earth's axis of rotation and the earth's molten magnetic core.
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Ed F



Joined: 22 Jan 2008
Posts: 301
Location: Ipswich, MA USA

Posted: Mon Jun 20, 2011 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I don't agree on every point in Richard Vetter's link, he has done a largely accurate characterization of astrology: a set of technologies for modeling and understanding experience.

- Ed
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pisceanfish



Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 16

Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 1:57 am    Post subject: 2 ways to go Reply with quote

Basically there are two ways that you can go:

[1] the physical framework: gravity, darkmatter or some other physical explanation leads to objects in outer space influencing human lives and our actions.

[2] the psychological framework: the astrological glyphs and their myths are all projections of our subconscious/emotions; our "inner life".

I tend to go for [2]. It is the "modern" approach in a 20th century of psychoanalysis. Liz Greene is a Jungian psychoanalyst who takes this approach to astrology, tarot cards and so forth.

This is simplified. It's a solid PHD topic for someone!
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waybread



Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 569
Location: Canada

Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2011 4:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nobody knows how astrology works.

There are various explanations, but if you peel back the onion layers and ask why they should work, we don't know.

God as the reason why astrology should work is actually not a bad explanation, but then a lot of astrologers are either atheists or believe in different divinities. "Scientific" explanations ranging from electro-magnetic waves to fractals are truly problematical at the level at which astrology functions. "Where did I lose my care keys?" is a horary question a good astrologer might successfully answer, but the scientific explanations that might just possibly influence character development tend to break down at the level of horary astrology.

Also, astrology does not work a lot of the time. Mistakes are common. Whether this is due to flaws inherent in astrology's methodology or to the practitioner's lack of skill is hard to say.

One thing to keep in mind is how much of astrology does not take place up in the sky, but in the mind of the astrologer. We would be nowhere without our calculations based on planetary positions, but once we move beyond them to discuss the human being (to say, for example, what Mars means in a specific chart,) we are basically dealing with the astrologer's ability to sleuth through the dozens of possible meanings of Mars, depending upon its specific horoscopic attributes, to come up with the right one fitting to the unique personality.

One book you might enjoy reading is Geoffrey Cornelius, The Moment of Astrology. He sees astrology as a form of divination. Which still doesn't precisely answer your question, as to why that should work.
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Muse



Joined: 17 Jul 2011
Posts: 3
Location: FL

Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

waybread wrote:
Nobody knows how astrology works.

There are various explanations, but if you peel back the onion layers and ask why they should work, we don't know.

God as the reason why astrology should work is actually not a bad explanation, but then a lot of astrologers are either atheists or believe in different divinities. "Scientific" explanations ranging from electro-magnetic waves to fractals are truly problematical at the level at which astrology functions. "Where did I lose my care keys?" is a horary question a good astrologer might successfully answer, but the scientific explanations that might just possibly influence character development tend to break down at the level of horary astrology.

Also, astrology does not work a lot of the time. Mistakes are common. Whether this is due to flaws inherent in astrology's methodology or to the practitioner's lack of skill is hard to say.

One thing to keep in mind is how much of astrology does not take place up in the sky, but in the mind of the astrologer. We would be nowhere without our calculations based on planetary positions, but once we move beyond them to discuss the human being (to say, for example, what Mars means in a specific chart,) we are basically dealing with the astrologer's ability to sleuth through the dozens of possible meanings of Mars, depending upon its specific horoscopic attributes, to come up with the right one fitting to the unique personality.

One book you might enjoy reading is Geoffrey Cornelius, The Moment of Astrology. He sees astrology as a form of divination. Which still doesn't precisely answer your question, as to why that should work.



You got to be kidding me! It almost seems like a contradiction that one believes in astrology and is yet...an atheist?

Its always made more sense, and seemed more logical to me than some sort of magnetic field affecting people. Maybe I am way off base but could it even be that the planets dont cause anything in themselves? That their movements are simply a way of seeing the manifestations of some divine will? If god created everything than he obviously created the planets as well Confused
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waybread



Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 569
Location: Canada

Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Muse, let's separate out horary, genethliacal (birth chart), and mundane (event) astrology.

Maybe we could make a case for some kind of energy such as electro-magnetic waves or a gravitational pull emanating from the planets and affecting individual human behaviour. The problem here is that astrology deals at a high level of specificity. Suppose we get a career question from someone with Mars in Aries in the career house, wondering what career would be best for him; with other chart factors supporting a "martial" career. Soldier? Athlete? Gun smith? Fireman?

We can hardly use Mars's position in the sky to make this determination. Of course, we consider additional chart factors. But then we have to explain how the other planets in their respective signs, houses, aspects, degrees, &c. interact with one another as well as the native using a magnetic field (or somesuch) causal explanation.

Some astrologers claim success in correlating planetary positions with weather or radio performance, but this is a long way from explaining why a woman with Venus in Scorpio will be jealous of her lover.

The problem multiplies if we consider that in astrology our signs and houses are basically arbitrarily assigned pie-sectors of the heavens.

So an awful lot of astrology takes place within the mind of the astrologer, in her social and cultural context, regardless of any scientifically believeable causal factors.

If we still cling to a magnetic field sort of theory for natal chart interpretation, it really breaks down at the level of horary. Maybe the hemoglobin in my blood somehow gets magnetized by Mars, but that doesn't explain how a horary reading can locate missing items.

Mundane astrology (global events, political outcomes, &c) is equally problematical. For example, if we look at a national chart such as the birth date of the US, we know from historians that it didn't happen all at once, but in a series of steps. Assuming we can choose a good date (like the US Sibly chart) then we have to think of how a disembodied event (like the signing of the Declaration of Independence) could be influenced by some kind of energy emanating from the planets.

Possibly a stronger case could be made for natural disasters like earthquakes, but the gravitational pull from the planets is minimal. It has been described as comparable, depending on the planet, to the pull of a cell phone or deck of cards on you from several football fields away.

Personally I like the Mind of God thesis: that we and the heavens are all part of a single holistic system; a bit like the Gaia hypothesis, but for the cosmos. But that's all it is: a thesis.
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Seiko



Joined: 05 Jun 2008
Posts: 363
Location: Latvia

Posted: Sat Aug 06, 2011 4:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Magnetic theory is kinda there but as waybread said it would magnetize our hemoglobin etc but how then it would help find a specific dog in a specific place which you can sometimes describe very accurately?

The precision of things in astrology is amazing. It's like a machine if you think about it. It is a very precise geometry. Why exactly 30 for a sign? Why, for example, one or two of the signs are not wider than the others?

The fact that it works is mind-boggling but also come to think of it the fact that people deciphered it is also unbelievable. I mean, who came up with house systems, receptions, falls and domiciles and everything. Aspects, fixed stars, combustion, retrogradation, cazimi for crying out loud. How many thousands and thousands of trials and errors were there? Or did the Clockmaker just say "Here's the system, here's the instruction how to use it. Enjoy!". If He exists, that is. If He does, He's not very involved in the processes going on in the world I must say.

We're not living in paradise, or hell. We're living in a little place where things happen. Both good and evil. And there's some clock mechanism which controls (or tells?) everything that happens. And it doesn't change, there's that constant recurring theme.

Maybe George Carlin was on to something when he said (he didn't believe in God and mocked religion) that there's no father figure but there could be The Big Electron as he called it which does not punish or reward, it just is.
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JamesG



Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 7

Posted: Fri Sep 30, 2011 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Being a retired Jungian analyst I think about the world and metaphysical sciences symbolically. I think the brain is wired to whatever universal consciousness that is out there, and people who choose to tap into it via astrology, tarot or any other divination methods - have a hard time explaining it to the non believer - because there are no words that express what cannot be explained - like the sound of one hand clapping.
It works for those that know it works (not belief) and it is a mystery for those that choose not to tap into it (not believe in it).
my 2 cents
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PCAPRI



Joined: 25 Oct 2011
Posts: 2
Location: UK

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2011 4:01 pm    Post subject: How Does Astrology Work? What about the skeptics? Reply with quote

Surely, the difficulties in convincing skeptics about astrology is that there are no convincing proofs. Not from their point of view, anyway, given that the zodiac we use is simply a way of dividing up the ecliptic. In other words, a neatly imposed scheme where each sign measures exactly 30 degrees. None of this would be very convincing to a skeptic. We measure a planet's position against (for them) an imaginary background.

More skepticism is derived from seeing 'your daily stars' in tabloid newspapers, and astrology critics think that this is where it's really at. That humanity is arbitrarily divided up into twelve different types, and that predictions can be made on the basis of 'where the stars are'.

The only way to know that astrology works is to study your own chart, follow the correct interpretive scheme and go from there. Hopefully, 'something' will dawn on you!
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Dave



Joined: 27 Oct 2011
Posts: 50

Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 9:16 pm    Post subject: How does astrology work? Reply with quote

The Universe is One. Everything in existence emanated from a tiny singularity, and has exactly the same origin. It all germinated from the same seed.

Therefore, what appears to us to be myriad "things" having each a separate existence is in reality One. Therefore, it follows that what IS or occurs there is also true here; the root does nothing without affecting the leaf and viceversa.

In astrology we have selected a convenient "set of symbols" (the solar system where we live) that has several features. First, it is a limited set -- we have few symbols with which to represent the totality of existence. Second,these symbols are bodies which are highly predictable, and their positions can be foreseen far into the future. Third, the symbols form an actual set in reaity...the solar system is an integrated unit. So the planets are a convenient set of symbols.

By using the solar system as our symbol set, we can portray each and every unique Moment (in space-time) with an equally unique arrangement of planets. Their positional relationships never repeat -- no two horoscopes are ever the same. Thus we can paint a portrait of a unique moment with our solar system.

The human mind literally creates our reality. We make our own world, in our mind. Each and every thing a man does, says, creates is simply a projection of the inner self into the outer world. The horoscope portrays the Moment of birth, and we are literally the manifestation of the Moment. The horoscope describes our Psyche, which is what creates our life and destiny.

In a nutshell......
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Seiko



Joined: 05 Jun 2008
Posts: 363
Location: Latvia

Posted: Thu Oct 27, 2011 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, this is weird. Just yesterday I was thinking about people being Creators, i.e., we are creating our own world. And then this post.

We are created by Nature to create, that is why there are no guidelines or instructions. Believe what you want, do what you want. Without the creative power, there is no evolution/development.

Each of us is just a manifestation of the One. That's why everybody is affected -- not in the same way, of course -- by an opposition with Saturn or by a conjunction with Jupiter, or whatever aspects are happening right now up in the sky.

So we know how it works. We have an idea or two WHY it works. But the question remains -- what's the point of this mystical evolution or whatever it is? For us humans, I mean. To reach some higher state a la buddhism?
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Seiko



Joined: 05 Jun 2008
Posts: 363
Location: Latvia

Posted: Fri Oct 28, 2011 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So each and every moment is the beginning of a new cycle. Somebody is born, somebody dies, somebody wins the lottery, a major disaster happens in some country -- technically, it all can happen as a result of the same cycle.

So the elective astrology is basically about trying to wait for the 'right' cycle and 'ride' it to achieve better results. And the horary astrology tells us whether it is a good or a bad cycle right now for the matter to happen. And the natal astrology is about the birth.

And even though the cycle itself (apparently) does not care about what happens -- somebody winning the lottery and the beginning of a major financial crisis at the same time/cycle -- apparently everything happens as it should happen because it is hard to imagine that the One or the Singularity would do something to harm or destroy itself. I mean, the ultimate destruction. It wouldn't make sense. So everything happens to the good, even the horrible stuff. Uh-oh.

Each and every cycle is unique as Dave mentioned, so the Singularity is constantly changing, evolving (and here you have the explanation behind the evolution -- new unique cycles create something different than before). But evolving into what? Does the Singularity have a goal? It is apparent that the Singularity is intelligent because we are -- and we are a part of it. Well, humans as a species probably will screw this world up royally rather sooner than later, but quite possibly that's what is supposed to happen. Every cycle has a beginning and an end.

Holy cow. How did I come to this. My father gave me a little book about astrology years ago and now I'm here writing some creepy stuff on the astrologers' forum. Apparently I caught the astrologer's cycle. Smile
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