Hi all, sorry for another juvenile question!

I am wondering what Lilly means when he mentions Saturn (occidental?) and in the 2nd station making someone more overweight than the 1st station, and also that this pertains to "all other planets."

He is five days in his first station before retrogradation, and so many in his second station before direct.

Maybe I have something mixed up. That seems a little backwards to me, but does it have something to do with Saturn being occidental vs. its prefered oriental direction? Why would the direct station be larger than the one before retro?

I know Robert Hand mentions in his "Reception" tutorial that his natal 1st house Jupiter oriental and retro (also exalted - nice and expansive) making him have some extra weight, and Jupiter prefers occidental direction. Lilly does mention Jupiter being more fleshy when oriental, but perhaps it is also the retro movement.

Here's Lilly's quote on Saturn:

Saturn in his first station, a little fat. In his second station, fat, ill favoured bodies, and weak; and this applies to all the other planets.

I might be wrong about the occidental direction of Saturn though. I read it on a "The Nature of the Planets" exerpt online, from Christian Astrology, but I don't see that linked to the sentence Lilly wrote exactly.

I'm further confused based on a thread about Lincoln that mentions his oriental Saturn should have made him more fleshy, which is counter to my idea of occidental Saturn:

http://www.skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewt ... d003f6c559

Separately, it would also go along way to explaining how an oriental Saturn could still produce Lincoln's skinny appearance; a feature inconsistent with the additional flesh on the body promised by an oriental Saturn.

Thanks, I hope I made some sense!

I edited that a bit because it didn't make any sense.

The planet, which is in its first station, is like a man who does not know what he will do, and its result is bad: if it is in its second station, it is like a man who expects something and whose hope will not be in vain.

Abraham Ibn Ezra seems to state that the second station is more favorable, which again makes me think it's weird that the body would be "weaker," etc. than the first station.

Sahl says in Precept 48 that a planet in its first station about to go retrograde signifies the destruction, tardiness, and dissolution of the matter, while the second station ?signifies the renewal of things and their suitability and strength or directness.?

Jupiter prefers occidental direction.

It is very clear in traditional sources that Jupiter prefers to be oriental to the sun.

Oops, sorry, that was a mistake. I am getting over bad bronchitis and my head is not so clear. Yes, it is a masculine planet and prefers oriental, like Saturn and Mars. Moon and Venus prefer occidental.

But it is still not clear to me why a planet in second station would be weaker and larger than a planet in first station. And I wonder how oriental/occidental is factored into height/weight. Is oriental generally taken to be larger, as was referenced in the Lincoln thread regarding Saturn oriental?

Tanit wrote: I am wondering what Lilly means when he mentions Saturn (occidental?) and in the 2nd station making someone more overweight than the 1st station, and also that this pertains to "all other planets."

He is five days in his first station before retrogradation, and so many in his second station before direct.

Maybe I have something mixed up. That seems a little backwards to me, but does it have something to do with Saturn being occidental vs. its prefered oriental direction? Why would the direct station be larger than the one before retro?

Lilly is referring only to the duration here: The first station of Saturn before retrogradation is 5 days - and his (second) station before his direct motion is 5 days too. As to the mere duration there is no difference between the stations. The station before direct is not longer than the one before retrograde.