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Was there a golden age of astrology?
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Steve



Joined: 16 Mar 2009
Posts: 261

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply Reply with quote

Quote:
dr.farr wrote:
If even only 1/3rd of the observations in the Brophy book are valid this would mean a revolutionary new understanding of the high degree of astronomical knowledge possessed several millennia earlier than the Egyptian Old Kingdom era.


Right on! Cyril Fagan came to the same conclusions near the end of his life (1971)-- after an intense study of Egypt’s old kingdom from an astronomical/astrological perspective. Modern day Scholars who are very knowledgeable in astronomy are correlating the same conclusions—it’s a huge mystery but solvable only to the astronomer/ astrologer. More astronomical evidence is being correlated with the ancient’s monuments and megaliths that indicates there was a high knowledge of astronomy predating the Egyptian Old Kingdom era.

Quote:
“One of the great enigmas presented by the ruins of many of these ancient cultures , most notably Egypt, is that they seem to have arisen very quickly out of nothing. The Great Pyramid is supposed to have been built near the beginning of this mysterious civilization. As author and rebel Egyptologist John Anthony West states, “The evidence for these advanced civilizations is almost universal in the sense that the all seem to be at their height near the beginning…practically all of them have deluge myths, practically all of them talk about earlier times, Golden Ages when people lived longer and were much more enlightened and advanced.” ‘Lost Star of Myth and Time’ pg 26.


West is indisputable correct with his historical observation that Egypt’s and other civilizations was at there height near their beginning. Stop and think about this for a moment—how can this be? As astrologers we need to ask ourselves the question-- could something cosmically be CAUSING THIS? As far as I am concerned, ‘Lost Star of Myth and Time’ answers and solves this glaring question/mystery beautifully. It is the astronomy of the Precessional Cycle that is causing the rise and fall of civilizations. And when the Earth enters the Sidereal Ages of Leo, Taurus, Aquarius, & Scorpio, Golden Ages appears--- and when the earth slowly leaves these Ages-- these same civilizations slowly Fall. As an astrologer, this means to me it’s the fixed stars of these constellations that are the agents which are causing these Golden Ages, which obviously has something to do with the consciousness/intelligence of humans, particularily with astrologers/astronomers. Does not our own Sun (Star) hold supreme importance with our consciousness? I also think the long perigee cycles of Earth and our Solar System with Sirius is the spiritual agent that also is responsible for one’s consciousness/intelligence. ‘Lost Star of Myth and Time’ is an important book for all astrologers—it’s a book far ahead of its time.

Regards, Steve
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With all our modern knowledge and scientific equipment, and with the the great strides made in mathematics, we astrologers have done nothing to even remotely compare with the achievements of the astrologers of antiquity. Cyril Fagan
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margherita



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 1311
Location: Rome, Italy

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 4:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Reply Reply with quote

Being an Italian obviously I vote for Renaissance.

It is well known by Saxl and before him Warburg, that Arabs had little interest other than for exactitude of calculations.

Writes Jean Seznec in the famous book "The Survival of the Pagan Gods: Mythological Tradition in Renaissance Humanism and Art" talking about astrology books :

"Hence it arises, as a first result, that the locations, sizes, and
groupings of the stars, often neglected by Western illustrators, are scrupulously reproduced, and if need be rectified, by the Arab copyists, whose principal concern is to determine the exact forms of real constellations. But another and no less logical consequence then follows: aside from their scientific value, the Hellenistic sky figures offer no interest to the Arabs."


It was just with Renaissance- especially in Italy, we have here so many samples- that astral myths came back to the light, even inside Churches, where surely they should no be so welcomed. And in fact all the astrology books printed were sold as bestsellers.

Astrologers lived in the court of the kings, at Papal courts, even Luther had Melanchton at his side (Luther was very skeptic, I know)- nothing could be done without consulting an astrologer.

Hardly compare this with the present

margherita
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Mark
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Joined: 30 Sep 2005
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Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Margherita,

Quote:
Being an Italian obviously I vote for Renaissance.


Ah so its a test of national allegiances now is it? Very Happy Well Scotland hasn't got much to offer so I better plump for the medieval period when we at least had Michael Scott. Thumbs up

Quote:
even Luther had Melanchton at his side (Luther was very skeptic, I know)-


Yes thats true. Something most evangelicals conveniently ignore. I would point it out more often if I could figure out how to pronounce Melanchton

Luther attitude to astrology seems a bit hard to fathom. On the one hand he closely colaborates with his astrologer lieutenant Melanchton?

However, I found this from a web article about Luther's attitude to science:

Quote:
Luther accepted astronomy as a science, but rejected astrology as a superstition because it cannot be confirmed by demonstration. Astrology, according to Luther, is idolatry and violates the first commandment. He was both amused and distressed by Melanchthon's interest in astrology, a belief system that was widely accepted at the time [8]. Instead, for example, Luther was ready to accept the conclusion of the astronomers that the moon is the smallest and lowest of the "stars." He interpreted the Scripture that called both the sun and the moon "great lights" as accommodating itself to the appearance of the phenomena [9]. Had this principle of accommodation based on interpreting the Bible in a phenomenological way been maintained after Luther's death, the tragic conflict in the modern era between science and biblical literalism could probably have been avoided.


The paradoxical thing is that Luther had no qualms about accepting the predictive power of phenomena such as comets and 'monstrous births'. When it came to these occurences Luther was content to accept that this was a prophecy that the Roman Catholic church was headed for decline. I can only assume he distinguished these as natural omens in contrast to astrology which is the product of human divination.

Quote:
Astrologers lived in the court of the kings, at Papal courts, even Luther had Melanchton at his side (Luther was very skeptic, I know)- nothing could be done without consulting an astrologer.

Hardly compare this with the present


Indeed its sounds tempting. It must have been great to live in a period when astrology commanded general respect rather than ridicule. I dont know about Italy but in the UK I am very careful who I mention my interest in astrology to. One acquaintance said after I told her 'but you seem such a sensible, level headed person?' The implication being that no sane, rational person could possibly accept astrology today!
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margherita



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 1311
Location: Rome, Italy

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MarkC wrote:
When it came to these occurences Luther was content to accept that this was a prophecy that the Roman Catholic church was headed for decline.


eehmmm.....

Let's say that Luther for what I know- there is a wonderful essay in Aby Warburg about Luther and his horoscope where Warburg explains how Luther used astrology as propaganda - if you remember we were under the war of pamphlets about who was more corrupted.

But he never believed to astrology- He wrote somewhere (now I don't remember where I took the quote) "I was born under evil stars, maybe under Saturn. When I ask others to do something for me, nothing is done...tailor, shoemaker, bookbinder, my wife, all make me wait the more is possible "

I guess that when Melanchton invited Gaurico- the astrologer of the Pope - in Wittemberg he should not be very happy...

margherita
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Mark
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Location: Edinburgh, Scotland

Posted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Let's say that Luther for what I know- there is a wonderful essay in Aby Warburg about Luther and his horoscope where Warburg explains how Luther used astrology as propaganda - if you remember we were under the war of pamphlets about who was more corrupted.


Thats consistent with Luther and Melanchton's pamphlets on 'monsters' and comets which were clearly propaganda pieces. As the ancient Greek dramatist Aeschylus wrote 'In war, truth is the first casualty'. The same kind of thing happened during the English civil war.

Quote:
I was born under evil stars, maybe under Saturn. When I ask others to do something for me, nothing is done...tailor, shoemaker, bookbinder, my wife, all make me wait the more is possible "


Nice quote Thumbs up

Quote:
there is a wonderful essay in Aby Warburg about Luther and his horoscope where Warburg explains how Luther used astrology as propaganda - if you remember we were under the war of pamphlets about who was more corrupted.


Sounds fascinating. Although I dont know if there is an English translation of his work. Still I did find this piece:

http://starsandstones.wordpress.com/2009/03/18/martin-luther/

Mark
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Richard Vetter



Joined: 03 May 2008
Posts: 54
Location: Offenburg, Germany

Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gjiada wrote:
I guess that when Melanchton invited Gaurico- the astrologer of the Pope - in Wittemberg he should not be very happy...

Gaurico "convinced" Melanchthon that Luther's year of birth was 1484 (in fact, Luther's mom was sure about the right day, but not about the year)...
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margherita



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 1311
Location: Rome, Italy

Posted: Sat Mar 06, 2010 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Richard Vetter wrote:
Gjiada wrote:
I guess that when Melanchton invited Gaurico- the astrologer of the Pope - in Wittemberg he should not be very happy...

Gaurico "convinced" Melanchthon that Luther's year of birth was 1484 (in fact, Luther's mom was sure about the right day, but not about the year)...


Not like that.
Melanchton was freaked to cast the birthchart of his friend Luther, and eventually invited Gaurico in Wittemberg.
There Gaurico presented the version Melanchton found the more convincing option, more than the one of Reformed astrologers - and evidently more than Luther's one (Melanchton should think that Luther temperament did not fit with the date he insisted).

Gaurico was a very skilled astrologer, he lived in the Papal court because he predicted his election to Peters' throne and was the astrologer who elected time of foundation of St. Peter Church. Evidently his rectification for Luther sounded very good to Melanchton.

margherita
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