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An Excellent Solar Return Book
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horarcek



Joined: 24 Jul 2005
Posts: 148
Location: Slovenia

Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Steve,
what one could expect from the Full Moon position in the middleground of SR chart ?
I have Eshelman´s book but I need a simple explanation (of page 69).

Thank you in advance,
Trojan
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Steve



Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply to horarcek Reply with quote

Quote:
horarcek asked:
what one could expect from the Full Moon position in the middleground of SR chart ?
I have Eshelman´s book but I need a simple explanation (of page 69).



Simple explanation: When Full Moons appear in Solar Return Charts, it usually symbolizes ‘some kind of concrete limits have been reached’ pertaining to a part of the native’s life, which will require ‘a reorientation of some sort.’ The full moon in a solar return chart symbolizes a shedding of much lunar ‘light’ on a phase of the individual’s life agenda & circumstances.

A perfect example of a Full Moon in a Solar Return Chart can be found in this thread with Obama’s 2009 Solar Return, which featured a 5.5 degree approaching Full Moon. On Jan 20th 2010, when the secondary Solar Moon progressed to a partile conjunct to his Sun (symbolizing the exact FULL Moon), Scott Brown, a Republican, was elected Senator of MA. This gave the Republican Party filibuster power which put a ‘concrete limit’ on the Democrat Party because they lost their full majority of 60 Senate Votes. The Democrat Party (Obama) had to ‘reorientate’ their political plans. Full Moon as well as New Moon symbolism in Solar Returns usually symbolizes some type of crisis-- but a-lot depends on how the Solar Return as a whole is aspected.

It is very important to distinguish between an approaching Full Moon or a separating Full Moon with Solar Return Charts. An approaching Full Moon is very important for detailed analysis because ONLY an approaching Full Moon can mature Partile progressed Solar Moon oppositions to Solar Sun. This also means an approaching Full Moon can set-up PARAN Solar Quotidians, whereas a separating Full Moon cannot set-up secondary progressed partile oppositions to the Sun or Paran oppositions with the Solar Quotidian Charts. Whenever I see an approaching ( within 12 degrees) Full Moon in a Solar Return Chart it deserves my full attention, regardless where it falls on the Solar Wheel—‘background’ or ‘middleground.’ The same would apply for approaching New Moons.

Regards, Steve
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BiBi_Anderson



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 82

Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree, but as well, even if it's seperating the conjunction for moon/sun can still produce powerful effects, not as powerful as partile, but still powerful indeed. Especially if the mo/su is aspecting another planet even if it's not dynamically. In my case in 1994, it was badly, I went into the hospital for sinus and throat surgery, I was just a young child before puberty, I almost died from toxemia, I spent over a month in the hospital, I actually had to be transferred from one hospital to a more major hospital because they had no idea what was going on with me. After that, It was not over, I had to be homeschooled for a very long time, because I had these terrible rashes, and in the middle of that, my mother had been indecisive about moving 20 miles away to another town to care for my sick grandmother. Even though it was not a huge move astrologically, I did not want to move, nedless to say we ended up moving, and we moved back in 2000.
Notice Pluto right on the ascendant, the moon/sun conjunction in the foreground seperating from Saturn. The mo/su cnj also sxt mars.....and the only thing that probably saved my life was the cnjs sxt to jupiter...terrible chart
This was my first surgery too by the way


One last note, Even though I am not an expert, I have noticed that by itself, the mo/su symbolism is benificial, even though it might cause a disruption that in the immediate moment may seem very stressful, when looked back upon, most of the time you tend to be greatful. When mixed with the benifics VE/JU.....alone, it's even better but I noticed that the malefics can over power this planetary pair even when benifics are involved.....in summation, Alone, it seems to be very benifical for moving on, and creating a change, but can be easily influenced even by static aspects. Remember that the same basic symbolism will probably apply for the 3 major dynamic aspects, just at varying strenghts ect.
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Steve



Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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Posted: Sun Aug 22, 2010 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply to BiBi's 1994 Solar Return Reply with quote

Excellent example BiBi (your 1994 Solar Return)! Partile New Moons & Full Moons in Solar Return Charts are highly indicative for events/incidents in one’s life that are not forgotten over a lifetime. Jim states on page 68 of ‘Interpreting Solar Returns:’

Quote:
In general, Sun-Moon aspects in a Solar Return represent crisis, i. e.significant turning points…


Your 1994 Solar Return features a partile conjunction of Sun-Moon (new moon) in the immediate foreground (within 7.5 degrees of an angle) backed-upped with Saturn & Pluto in the immediate foreground. Saturn is throwing a 4 degree (‘serious influence’) opposition to your Solar lights-- the new moon; and, your 1994 angular Solar Return lights are afflicted by a tight angular greater malefic-Saturn. Angular Solar Pluto is symbolizing its ‘dramatic’ symbolism and as you pointed our ‘a first’ time operation.

Also, it is noteworthy to note your Natal partile conjunction of Mars & Uranus at 10 degrees Sag is T-Squaring your 1994 Solar Return New Moon and your 1994 Solar Return Saturn. Mar-Uranus symbolism is a par-excellent aspect for surgical ‘operations.’ Jim teaches that when important Natal aspects are prominently aspected to Solar Return configurations it will show us ‘how’ the native will ‘react’ to the Solar Return symbolism—you ‘reacted’ with a surgical ‘operation.’

A striking and amazing example of a Solar Return featuring a New Moon! Thanks for posting.

Regards, Steve
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BiBi_Anderson



Joined: 28 May 2007
Posts: 82

Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Steve,
It's one of my favorite charts too
We should work on a book or some website and try to spread our findings to others. Secret
Anyway, when you you say a natal was a reaction, and surgery was my reaction.....I thought surgery was more of the outside influence, and the way I reacted to everything would be more of the natal..That the the Conjunction just activated my natal MA/UR Conjunction, and made more more attractive to people who would to slice and dice me. Thankfully it only expressed it self through surgery, and not violence.
You really can't react by needing a surgery, unless it's something like cosmetic. This was something that was thrust on me, especially just being a child.
I was also going to ask, what zodiac do you prefer, I prefer the sidereal, just because 1 it's less work, and it seems to be more descriptive, but again, it's seems to be a very weak influence
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Steve



Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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Posted: Mon Aug 23, 2010 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply to BibI Reply with quote

Quote:
BiBi asked:
I was also going to ask, what zodiac do you prefer, I prefer the sidereal, just because 1 it's less work, and it seems to be more descriptive, but again, it's seems to be a very weak influence.


I do not use a zodiac (sign or constellation interpretations) in my work with astrology. I do not read natal charts by themselves-- only in conjunction with solar returns, lunar returns, and quotidian charts as Jim teaches in his book. This is not to say Natal readings are not important to an individual. My small following of clients, mainly businessmen, only want to know what they can expect to experience with planetary symbolism from year to year (solar return). When my clients are involved in important business activities (meetings) they are interested mainly in quotidian charts, preceding lunar return, and current progressions. It is my opinion; the younger a client-- more demand for mainly natal readings, the older the client—more demand for what is happening NOW with their planetary symbolism return charts, progressions, solar arcs. I am old and my clientele are old. I do not charge any fees for my astrology work. I let my client determine the value of my work and I am only paid when the client thinks my work has any value and made a difference in a win-lose business situation. This accounts for much of my learned astrology including my books. I am a retired business person—never depended on income from my astrology work. I was told when I was very young, by a high grade psychic—I would be initiated with some very important, out of print astrology books, as well as other books pertaining to ancient Egypt-- which would become very important with my personal astrological research—this has indeed become true on a personal life level. I am late in my life and plenty of leisure time—just trying to ‘pass on’ to other astrologers my experience and learning of astrology. I strongly feel that some outstanding astrological research was done by obscure individual astrologers in the 20th century and most of this work went unnoticed by many of today’s astrologers. The siderealist as individuals also did some brilliant life-long work in the 20th century—I am trying to draw attention to their individual work.

If I were to choose a zodiac—it would be the sidereal for two reasons—1: don’t have to account for precession with long time measures. 2: my work has convinced me the ancient Egyptian astrologers/astronomers used the sidereal zodiac. I believe as Cyril Fagan, the ancient Egyptian astrologers/astronomer were par-excellent. I only use the tropical zodiac (precession corrected returns) on this forum because I realize 98% of today’s astrologers cut their teeth on the tropical zodiac—don’t want to get into any debates over which zodiac is correct—waste of my energies and a un winnable debate.

Steve
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BiBi_Anderson



Joined: 28 May 2007
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Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was not trying to start a debate, just curious Very Happy
I really believe the zodiac has more to do with some kind of global consciousness
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horarcek



Joined: 24 Jul 2005
Posts: 148
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Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 6:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Steve,

what are your experiences with Lunar nodes on SR angles ?

Trojan
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Steve



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Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 12:44 pm    Post subject: Reply to horarcek Reply with quote

horarced asked:
Quote:
what are your experiences with Lunar nodes on SR angles


I generally agree with Reinhold Ebertin’s genethlical work—the lunar node on the angles of a Solar Return emphasizes ‘associations’ with people in our immediate environment. Determining which people with the node by itself on an angle requires questioning by the astrologer with the client/native. When there are partile or tight aspects with other planets to the node on the angle-- offers sound symbolism to which people in the immediate environment draws the attention of the native. For example: If you found the lunar node on the 7th house cusp partile squaring Venus—this would be potent symbolism the solar year would manifest an ‘outstanding incident’ pertaining to the effects of romance/love—pertaining to ‘associates’ in the immediate environment. If this same node on the 7th house cusp was partile square Mercury with a businessman, then there would be potent symbolism for ‘outstanding incidents’ pertaining to business ‘associates’. It all depends on the individual ‘people’ priorities with the native. The lunar node by itself on a SR angle, with no featured aspects to natal or solar planets is just symbolizing a solar year with more activity than normal with the close 'associates' in your life.

On Page 64 of Ebertin’s book the ‘Combinations of Stellar Influences’ he states pertaining to ‘The Dragon’s Head’, the lunar node:

“Principle: Association or alliance. Sociological Correspondence: Meetings, alliances, societies, contact-people, blood-ties, kindred and related people.”

Regards, Steve
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Steve



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Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply to BibI Reply with quote

BiBi wrote:
Quote:
I really believe the zodiac has more to do with some kind of global consciousness.


Indeed it does! The zodiac, planets, and stars certainly permeates through our individual consciousness and sometimes the mundane astrologer glimpses this permeation of consciousness on a collective group level.

Steve
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BiBi_Anderson



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Posted: Wed Aug 25, 2010 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I remember Jim also saying on the solunar forums as well that the aspects to lunar nodes act like aspect to the moon, eg mars sq the lunar nodes would be like mars sq a weaker version of the moon, and that applies to other planetary nodes as well...they have just not been studied and proven in the astrological realm to function on que like the lunar nodes.
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BiBi_Anderson



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Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 3:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope I can post two charts where the nodes and natal Venus were highlighted...Natal Venus, giving lots of love, but sadly, not getting it back as reflected by transiting Venus.
These two charts are a solar and a Demi-Solar borth for the same year, but reflect to a T-what was going on in my romantic life.




In both return charts the Nodes and the Moon are highlighted, In the main 2005 Solar Chart the moon is rising on the Asc and cnj natal Venus, my emotions were fixed on persuing love, but without transiting Venus foreground it was not very promising. The nodes were also square my natal moon...... signifies a spiritual like or connection with others.....I did feel all of this for my ex boyfriend and the time, we were having a lot of problems, and I was holding on to the point of being delusional, until he came back in 2006

The Demi-Solar Return is an even more depressing and descreptive map of what went on, the nodes are on the meridian minutes away from natal Venus, Natal Venus is only 1-2 minutes away from the meridian....activating my heart, making me want to persue a relationship with the man I loved, but, transiting Venus was not strong, Natal Moon was a few minutes away from the DSC(Even More Descriptive) & there was a transiting square been the Moon and Saturn promising dissapointment. My bf and I actually cut off contact for a very long time after this Demi started. Do you look at the Demi steve?
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Steve



Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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Posted: Thu Aug 26, 2010 9:05 pm    Post subject: Reply to BiBI Reply with quote

Hi BiBi,

Your 2005 Solar Return is an excellent example when tight/partile planets conjunct a SR angle with a tight/partile conjunction or opposition to a natal planet. As you pointed out, your Solar Moon is Conjunct Natal Venus both conjuncting the SR Ascendant. This is a very potent influence and as Jim teaches from his book ‘Interpreting Solar Returns,’ this Moon Venus symbolism will be the main ‘theme’ for the solar year. When we see a Natal Planet Conjoin a Solar Planet near or on a Solar Angle Jim states on page 47:

Quote:
“Natal Planets signify the ingrained basic life pattern of an individual. As they come to the foreground (angles) in a Solar Return, these intrinsic factors (in your 2005 Solar Return-Natal Venus) are emphasized. Natal Planets conjunct Solunar angles essentially show how an individual is reacting personally to the foreground (angular) transiting planets which dominate the Solunar.”


As we can see the exact moment of your 2005 Solar Return transiting Moon was tightly conjunct your Natal Venus at 4Li54, falling on your SR Ascendant. Because your Natal Venus is conjunct the angular SR Moon we know from Jim’s brilliant teachings you are going to ‘REACT’ to this angular Solar Moon with Venus symbolism—Love/Romance. But the MOST IMPORTANT KEY to your 2005 Solar Return is the tight angular SR Moon is partile 135 Solar Mars. As I have repeated many times in this thread, when we find angular placements of Solar Planets and they receive DYNAMIC partile aspects from other planets—then we are alerted to an ‘outstanding incident’ according to the partile planetary aspect. Jim states on page 96 of ‘Interpreting Solar Returns’:

Quote:
“It is when angularity and aspect partility coincide that outstanding incidents are most likely to come about.”


What is the nature of this foretold Solar Return ‘outstanding incident’? The nature of this ‘outstanding incident’ is of a Martian nature. I don’t know the exact details but I don’t need to know them. Mars is the lesser malefic and its malefic actions manifest with disputes, fights, arguments-anger. Natal Venus dead-on the SR Ascendant tells us, as Jim teaches, there is going to be a love/romance ‘theme.’ The ONLY partile planetary ‘dynamic’ aspect SR angular Moon receives is from SR Mars—so the astrologer well versed in Jim teachings sees a high probability of a Martian fight that breaks ups the romance—Mars puts a dagger in the native’s heart. Mars patiles 135 the SR ascendant and also, not by coincidence, dynamically partiles 45 the MC. Malefic Mars with its symbolism afflicts this Solar Return.

Quote:
BiBi asks:
Do you look at the Demi steve?


A Demi is another solar return chart cast when the transiting Sun precisely 180’s your Natal Sun. And yes, I do look at Demi’s—but I only pay attention when I see tight angular activity preferably receiving partile aspects and/or with the Demi Moon having partile aspects. Your Demi from your 2005 Solar Return fits both of my criteria’s with partile square of Demi Moon to Demi Saturn and the Demi lunar north node partile conjunct Demi’s MC partile 120 Demi Saturn. Remember in an earlier post I said the only time I pay attention to soft aspects is the 120 with angular activity. This partile 120 of Demi Saturn to the Demi’s lunar node dead-on the Demi’s MC is symbolizing an ‘outstanding incident’ with a SEPERATION from an ‘associate’ and the partile square of Demi Moon to Demi Saturn is symbolizing the depression that follows during the Demi’s time period.

Thanks BiBi for posting another fine example of the acute angular/partile planetary symbolism-- we at times in our lives find with Solar Returns. As Jim states on page 139:

Quote:
“Once precession is expelled from our calculation processes, Solar Returns & Lunar Returns begin to speak in a language that is clear, lucid, expressive, delivering a message which is accurate, if not prophetic.”


Steve
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BiBi_Anderson



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Posted: Sat Aug 28, 2010 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Have we covered the Auxilary angles and sensitive points yet?
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Steve



Joined: 16 Mar 2009
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Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply to BiBI Reply with quote






Quote:
BiBi asked:
Have we covered the Auxiliary angles and sensitive points yet?


Jim addresses the Auxiliary angles and sensitive points on pages 18 & 19 from his book ‘Interpreting Solar Returns.’

It has been my experience these auxiliary angles and sensitive points, at times, can produce important aspected configurations foretelling ‘outstanding incidents’ in the native life. However, with my experience you will see much less planetary configurations pertaining to ‘outstanding incidents’ involving auxiliary angles and sensitive points, than the primary angles of the meridian & horizon. Also, I allow, as Jim teaches, much smaller orbs to the auxiliary angles and sensitive points than I would for the primary angles of the meridian & horizon. For example: I allow an orb of 7.5 degrees to the primary angles with planets but only an orb of 2-3 degrees with the auxiliary angles and sensitive points.

Jim’s Auxiliary angles are:

East Point & West Point (directly opposite each other in the chart). Jim says:

Quote:
“Extremely significant positions, they mark the intersections of three important great circles: the horizon, the celestial equator and the prime vertical.”


Zenith & Nadir (opposite each other in the chart). Both of their longitudes mark the meridian’s circle’s intersection with the prime vertical. Jim says about these four points of the auxiliary angles:

Quote:
“I allow a 2-3 orb for these angles. The East Point and West Point are substantially more powerful than the Zenith and Nadir.”


The four sensitive points are the Vertex and Antivertex-South Point and North Point (opposite each other in the chart)—orb allowance 2-3 for the Vertex axis and 1-2 degrees for the North/South points. Jim says about the Vertex axis:

Quote:
“Planets conjunct, opposite, or square the Vertex are highly accented, but any actual manifestations seem to be unconsciously motivated.”


I have included a Solar Return chart in this post with striking Vertex sponsored symbolism where an individual was a sweepstakes winner of 120,000 K. Note Solar Jupiter is partile conjunct Solar Vertex partile squaring Solar Venus. As we can see Solar Jupiter and Solar Venus, the two benefits of our planetary system were certainly ‘highly accented’ by partile aspects with the Solar Vertex. And again we can see Jim’s teaching axiom when we see angular planets set up with partile aspects we see manifestations of ‘outstanding incidents.’

The references and birth data, along with more details about this Solar Return example, can be reviewed on page 1 of this thread under the topic ‘an outstanding incident.’

Steve
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