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Ox wrote:The Air element, which is conventionally aligned with Thinking, is displaying this quality as a 'compensatory effect' spurned on by Sensation. And the Earth element, which is conventionally aligned with Sensation, is displaying this quality as a 'compensatory effect' spurned on by Thinking.

That's the meaning I got from your post amzolt. :)
Thanks for explaining your response!

Actually, when you say, "The Air element, which is conventionally aligned with Thinking...", I must add that the "convention" of Air/Thinking is incorrect.

If that is true then, "...is displaying this quality as a 'compensatory effect' spurned on by Sensation.", would not be a valid conclusion.

Thinking and Sensation are not "compensatory". Thinking and Feeling as well as Intuition and Sensation are compensatory.

I'm very happy you've brought up the Conscious/Unconscious Compensation phenomenon but I don't think it applies between Thinking and Sensation.

The Thinking/Air and Sensation/Earth attributions are just wrong but still the compensatory process is what led me to making the Thinking/Earth and Sensation/Air attributions...
~ Alex from Astrological Repair Manual

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Perhaps the crux of the problem is merely a confusion in terms then.

For example, an Earth/Thinking type may relieve itself by a full out immersion in the senses, but then in turn is associated with the term 'Sensation' because of the symptoms it displays.

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Ox wrote:Perhaps the crux of the problem is merely a confusion in terms then.

For example, an Earth/Thinking type may relieve itself by a full out immersion in the senses, but then in turn is associated with the term 'Sensation' because of the symptoms it displays.
Are you conversant with Jung's description of the Types?
~ Alex from Astrological Repair Manual

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These 3 links should clarify this :
http://www.friesian.com/types.htm
http://thezodiac.com/soul/elements/cornerstones.htm
http://psychclassics.yorku.ca/Jung/types.htm

''Sensation Type or Function (Element of Earth - Taurus, Virgo, Capricorn): A person whose main function is sensation (earth) trusts rational, objective information which is practical and can be observed and gathered directly through the five senses of sight, taste, hearing, direct, and taste. Jung: "people who restrict themselves to the simple perception of concrete reality."

'Thinking Type or Function (Element of Air - Gemini, Libra, Aquarius): A person whose main function is thinking (air) makes rational, objective decisions based on hard, cold, logic and on logical connections. Jung: they are "oriented to what they think, and simply cannot adapt to a situation they cannot understand intellectually."

If you agree with the 'modern' understanding of the astrological signs it is quite a seamless relationship.

The previous chat here focused on the relationship between Jung's types and the 4 traditional humors, which was quite contentious. The 'truth' of all of this may need to wait until someone, with a sophisticated understanding of all the perspectives, spends a few yrs looking into it and writes a lengthy book.

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trevor wrote:The 'truth' of all of this may need to wait until someone, with a sophisticated understanding of all the perspectives, spends a few yrs looking into it and writes a lengthy book.
I have spent many more than a few years doing much more than looking into it and I am writing a book...
~ Alex from Astrological Repair Manual

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Yes, but...

it shouldn't come as such a shock, that when someone spends more energy defending the depth of their well than providing actual sustenance for discussion, they could very well be seen as compensating...

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Ox wrote:Yes, but...

it shouldn't come as such a shock, that when someone spends more energy defending the depth of their well than providing actual sustenance for discussion, they could very well be seen as compensating...
One more attempt to clarify my position.

In Jung's typology, Intuition and Sensation are opposite, compensatory types and Feeling and Thinking are as well.

No one seems to be arguing that Intuition=Fire and Feeling=Water. So...

What is opposite Fire and compensates for it? Air. Just as Earth compensates for Water.

I hope that clarifies my position.
~ Alex from Astrological Repair Manual

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It seems to make sense on paper, but perhaps Jung defined his Types outside the boundaries of 'just astrology', and had more of a shamanic 'ideal' in mind when it came aligning polarities.

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Ox wrote:It seems to make sense on paper, but perhaps Jung defined his Types outside the boundaries of 'just astrology', and had more of a shamanic 'ideal' in mind when it came aligning polarities.
Two questions:

What, in your opinion, is "just astrology"?

Do you really feel Jung only worked on "paper"?

Two comments:

Jung based his psychology theories on a life-time of empirical interaction with people of all types.

Any form of astrology is an expression of an underlying psychology.
~ Alex from Astrological Repair Manual

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Fair enough,

Instead of repeating myself twice, let me rephrase the statement.

Your inferences from Carl Jung's vast body of eclectic work may be right on some level, however, because Jung drew from so many eclectic resources you could also be wrong on many other levels.

I have one question for you now,

Do you see yourself being 'absolutely' right on this?

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amzolt wrote: Jung based his psychology theories on a life-time of empirical interaction with people of all types.
But are they correct?
amzolt wrote: Any form of astrology is an expression of an underlying psychology.
Why?
Gabe