Mystery Chart No. 18

1
Time for a challenge. What does the chart tell us about this man?

Male
Jan 13, 1821
11:33 PM LMT
Chesterville, Maine USA
44 N 33' 04"
70 W 05' 12"
12 Libra 47 rises

Solar Return fans might want to check out 1875 and maybe 1876. However those are not the only important years in his life.


Image

By tciii

Try more for general characteristics of the native. Identifying him by profession might not be easy.

Tom

2
So his profession wouldn't have anything to do with the sea or the law or some combination thereof?

Jupiter in Pisces in the 6th with a nifty sextile to the Sun and Mars in 4th, and Moon in Gemini sextile Saturn ruling the Cancer MC? He certainly would have had the brains for it, probably a good orator/writer, and able to appeal to juries, etc. Plus Jupiter is exalted in Pisces (underdog), sixth house (underdog again). And both Jupiter and MC are watery. Plus he's got Mercury dead on the IC in Cap. Whatever he did, it required a good bit of skill and study, and he appears to have been equal to the task.

Given the mutable Moon and the mutable Jupiter, I'm going to guess he had more than one profession.

3
Tom is such a great guy... I asked for a toy and he gave it to me in the same day!

Individual is more choleric-sanguine, driven by action and desire, loud, quick, etc. But noticed that his asc, moon, fortuna AND spirit are all in signs of air ! So his motivations are all based on the search of freedom, communication and even knowledge! He will be a lot more talkative, mercurial than your average choleric.

Almost everything in his chart, from asc to manners and almuten figuris point out to Saturn in Aries. Saturn is not in great shape! He is a nocturnal planet in its fall in aries, but he is also angular, and is not retrograde, so he can provide many things for the native.

He is in a royal sign. As neither sun nor moon can see the sign of Leo, Saturn has a lot of saying about the 11th house, as he has triplicity and terms right over the cusp of the 11th (I am using alchabitius and egyptian terms).

So, I think that it is possible that, in some moment of his life, this man was involved with politics. He seems to both have the oratory skills, and the search for power.

As both moon and mercury are applying to saturn, maybe writing is a important thing in his life?

The MC ruler is the moon (also ruler of the lot of exaltation), which is in aversion to it. So, there is disagreement and problems with career, specially with women or the "general public". But Jupiter is aspecting and he is in his own sign, pisces, in the 6th, a very powerful position for career. Besides its aversion to its sign, the moon is with fortuna.

Jupiter can give good quality for these matters, but as he is also out of sect, in a feminine sign, under the horizon, etc, I don?t think that he will give it with consistency. It will probably alternate between better and worse periods. But I believe he will achieve a good state on life.

So, we see eminence. The sun is angular, and in mutual reception with angular saturn, in the 11th sign from fortuna. Moon, ruler of the MC and lot of exaltation is with fortuna. Fortuna is cadent. So there probably is a limited level of fame. He may not be a nobel prize or a president, but he can achieve some level of recognition.

Venus is very important in this chart too. She is ruler of the ASC, oriental to the Sun, joined to Jupiter, his dispositor. This may represent her connections again to knoledge (like writing and teaching) or religion, as venus represents piety and rites of purification.

I hope I am not completely delusional ! It is 2:30 AM over here ! I will try to see the solar returns...
Meu blog de astrologia (em portugues) http://yuzuru.wordpress.com
My blog of astrology (in english) http://episthemologie.wordpress.com

4
Ah heck, why not .... Using Whole Sign Houses:

Movement and change. Lots of it. Restlessness and looking forward.

ASC and Trad 7 planets are all Cardinal or Mutable.

Good dose of Sanguine is perhaps another broad indicator of movement, making connections.

Cardinal Libra ASC ruler Venus in restless Mutable Sagittarius in cadent 3rd house of communication and transportation (links and connections), square her dispositor Jupiter at home in Mutable Pisces. It seems likely that there were many writing/communication or transportation activities.

4 of the Trad 7 planets are in angular houses (and Cardinal signs). Plenty of action and initiation.

Sun conjunct exalted Mars in Cardinal Capricorn, sextile Jupiter in Pisces. Ambition, restlessness, change. Not a weak and softened Mars, but a Mars-like Sun. Together with with the Mercury-Saturn square in Capricorn-Aries, lots of action ? irritation even. Diurnal Saturn can get ugly in a nocturnal chart, especially when it's in fall and peregrine in Aries. A cruel streak or ruthlessness? The Pisces Jupiter sextile Sun-Mars may soften any cruelty, but Jupiter is in the cadent 6th, a diurnal planet in a nocturnal chart, and in its phlegmatic phase in relation to the Sun. A cooled down sluggish Jupiter can't have much to offer ? or the ability to offer it.

What to say about Moon as sect light in a nocturnal chart and nocturnally placed above the horizon? It has the chance to be important, especially with its rulership of the 10th house. But Gemini can also be a rather cruel sign and the Moon placed there isn't in the greatest shape for heartfelt gestures. The Moon's next applying sextile to that peregrine, in fall, nocturnal Saturn in Aries looks important. In fact much points to Saturn as the important planet and instigator of major life events and conditions. Saturn and Mars, I would say. I wonder if it's significant that Venus just recently conjoined the natal Saturn and will fairly soon be retrograding back over it?

The action of the 4th and 7th houses involving Sun, Mars, Mercury and Saturn looks like death was perhaps a major player somehow in the person's life. Whole Sign houses puts the Moon in the 9th, but I usually look at multiple house systems now to see if I'm being drawn into a particular direction. Equal, Porphyry, and Placidus all draw the Moon into the 8th. It starts out as a 9th house Moon but is drawn into the 8th, so it looks like a drawing toward death. Murderer, executioner, mortician, military man, or a tough surgeon who can easily cut the 'bad pieces' out or off? ...

************

Just thought of something wacko as I was going to submit. We're here to have fun, right? So:
I do get the feeling here of a fighter. The 6th house is traditionally involved with slavery. That 6th house Piscean Jupiter struck me as a potential abolitionist fighting against slavery, especially after cheating by taking the year of birth and New England location in mind. It does also tie in with Jupiter's sextile to the 4th house Sun-Mars conjunction. In the past I've seen 4th house connections to racial issues. It would be a real hoot if we could add the 3rd house influence of 'transportation' and say the guy was part of the underground railroad and helped escaped slaves get to Canada. :D

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When born his father was probably ill, or would come to die soon stroken by an illness. The applying square of Mercury, ruler of 12th would give further testimony to that. He lost his father maybe at the age of 5?

What could not be missed: PoF conjunct Moon on 8th, Sun separating from conjunction to Mars on 4th. Heritages played an important role in this man's life, and he would be heir of an decent sum of properties. Still, that would not compare to what he would attain later in life.

Through marriage he would get even richer, making his possessions even more substantial. Maybe he was a gold miner, or someone who looked for something precious under the earth? Other than that a farmer?

Yuzuru said he was a politician. I guess he was owner of properties in the first place. If he became politician, was due to his position of power. Also, he being a Libra rising with such strong Mars leads me to believe he was somewhat hot headed, irascive and straightforward.

He would have problems with children, maybe he lost a son or two? Still, to raise a family would be among his aims life, presence of North Node on 5th gives indication to that.

His bussiness partnerships tended to somewhat endanger him financially, presence of South Node on 11th opposing Jupiter and Squaring Moon and PoF alongside other details leads me to believe that.

About his SR for 1875, Mars on AC, Venus on 2nd Cusp and Saturn on 3rd forms a Square and a Sextile config that leads me to believe that Mars, as ruler of his 2nd, made him even richer than already was. The Sun returns to it's place, and Mercury returns to Mars place. In the 3rd house, that leads me to believe that it goes to media, and the news travelled. Maybe he discovered oil or something like that (don't know if in this time that would be important or if oil was already used or not, so forgive any historic mistake).

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About his SR for 1875,
I should have mentioned this earlier, but it appears that he spent his 1875 and possibly his 1876 solar return in the San Francisco, CA area.

Tom

7
Hello,

To me it seems that this person was involved in military activities.
Mars in exaltation, in night chart, conjunct Sun, New Moon aplying to Mars, Mars matutine, in corde solis. Mars in fourth house less productive, and with struggle (could also be something hidden, secret). Probably Mercury is also involved in his career, although I think that its influence is not quite so good.
Saturn in seven house and in Aries, contrary to the sect, it's not good for career.

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Libra Asc with Venus in Sag in 3rd - native is social, enjoys travel, maybe a bit of an adventurer or 'good sport'; pleasant in speech and appearance. Not someone who would like manual or hard work.

Square Jupiter in Pisces in the 6th trine MC - Jupiter is ambitious for dignities; and Jupiter is sextile the Mars/Sun conjunction in the 4th which would give a martial and commanding bent to his ambitions. Jupiter is sextile Moon in 8th, ruler of MC which opposes Venus, Asc ruler. Indicating he gained some type of fame or notoriety related to his death and this was somehow connected to his career. Possibly a general or military commander?

The Mars/Sun conjunction in the 4th is very strong and disposited by Saturn in Fall in the 6th -- 4th is conditions at the end of life, this looks like a famous failed military battle to me. But I'm of two minds, since it also looks like an inheritance that was squandered or given away.

Overall, it strikes me as the chart of someone who lived life large, didn't work to hard at anything and in the end gained some fame or notoriety by the way he died or something he did just prior to his death.

9
Well, people seem to be in vacation, where are the big guns? Steven?
:D
PFN, when I said politics, I didn?t mean in the sense of Bill Clinton, let?s do a speech, etc, more in the sense of being involved with movements and people in places of power, maybe. But I am probably wrong, fire can mean so different things...

Many people said that it would be a military, but the chart doesn?t seem so military to me... In fact, to me it would be more likely to be an actor than a fighter, it is similar to the chart of David Bowie, but Tom said to not bother looking for a profession :-). Well, it is all possible at this point.

In 1875, the key to understand this period is mars. The sub firdaria is changing to mars in october. The progression of the ASC is going to sextile sun/mars! The ASC and the seconary directed sun are moving from their terms, so it seems like a really changing year.

But what mars means? It seems too late in his life to be about father and family. In a personal level, maybe it is marriage... Firdaria of venus and subfirdaria or mars, mars conj. Sun (exaltation of 7th). Profection is also going to the 7th house. But it doesn?t seem all that likely in the SR: mars and venus are in aversion in this revolution.

There are indications in the SR that his physical life will be in the spotlight, even in danger, but I am really kinda of lost in what to look for it.
Meu blog de astrologia (em portugues) http://yuzuru.wordpress.com
My blog of astrology (in english) http://episthemologie.wordpress.com

10
Heritages played an important role in this man's life, and he would be heir of an decent sum of properties. Still, that would not compare to what he would attain later in life.
Although he has some interesting indications of heritage by family or marriage (fortuna in 8th by division), I am not so sure he is so luck by himself.

Saturn, despite being the exaltation ruler of the Ascendant, is also a malefic in fall, occidental to the sun, contrary to sect, with only mutual reception to mars, his dispositor, to help, but his dispositor is combust... Saturn is in the 11th from fortuna, so, I don?t think he can really be so lucky in his fortune. Fortuna is cadent, and mercury is angular, but he is in aversion to fortuna, so again this is not testimony of great riches accumulated in life. I may be wrong, as mercury is partile to Saturn, with reception. But I don?t think it is enough to be an extreme wealthy individual. We will see.
Meu blog de astrologia (em portugues) http://yuzuru.wordpress.com
My blog of astrology (in english) http://episthemologie.wordpress.com

11
yuzuru wrote:Many people said that it would be a military, but the chart doesn?t seem so military to me
I don't think the native has a martial nature but Mars ruling the 7th has a stronger analogy to war, conflicts than it does to marriage. Maybe a famous legal battle over an inheritance?

Can't see it coming out well for him; Mars conj Sun square a bad Saturn does not look good; although the sextile from Jupiter may mitigate the difficulties to some extent.

In looking at ZRS, he's in an Aries-Capricorn period during 1975 so the 7th and 4th are emphasized, the loosing of the bond in Cancer occurs on July 17, 1875 so rulers for the period are Mars-Moon with Saturn still having some say being square Mars and sextile Moon. Mars and the Moon are averse, indicating a change in conditions involving the career.

The minor profection comes to Scorpio, Mars other house, on Aug 1, 1875. Scorpio is the 2nd, personal finances and Moon is in 8th of shared finances; so possibly financial considerations are key. On Aug 30 the bond is released from Gemini to Capricorn; not a good indication.

So that Mars-Sun conjunction looks to be key if we could figure out exactly what it presages.

An exalted Mars ruling the 2nd (substance) and 7th (conflicts, lawsuits) in 4th (family, land, buildings) conj Sun, ruler of the 11th (friends) - assistance from friends with high positions? or difficulties because of them? Square Saturn (family, father, fixed assets) in 6th -- he's 54 so seems to old to still have a father alive. Could Saturn be the condition of his assets? Saturn also rules 5th of children -- does he have any? Aquarius on the 5th with a weak, afflicted Saturn doesn't look as if it would produce offspring.

Whatever it is, it still looks like a public battle of some sort that does not go well for him.

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Hi Steven ... your comments on a possible signature for astrologers are really interesting; very curious now to know this native's profession.

Congratulations on the new job, all the best :)