Hellenistic Astrology - Preliminary Natal Analysis

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Hello all,

I thought it would be nice to post the notes that I have compiled from Robert Schmidt's lectures (the main being the talk delivered in St Petersburg and Joseph Crane's latest book - "Hellenistic Legacy") and also other notes discovered through the net.

According to Schmidt, "modern" hellenistic astrologers usually divide hellenistic astrology in three broad areas:

1) Preliminary natal analysis - where planets are judged whether they are able to conduct their businesses or whether they are favorable or unfavorable to the native
2) Universal and specific techniques
3) Timing techniques (esp. those time lords)

In this post, I shall cover the first area of chart delineation i.e. preliminary natal analysis.

There are two classes of conditions that modify the planetary conditions:

1. Conditions that relate to the overall fitness or ability of a planet to conduct its business

2. whether the business that the planet conducts is favorable or unfavorable.


Conditions that relate to the fitness or ability of a planet to conduct its business

a) Conditions relative to the horizon:

If a planet is in an angular or succedent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place conducive to conduct its business.

If the planet is also angular by dynamic house system e.g. Prophyry, the planet is said to be goaded towards more activity.

If a planet is in a cadent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place not conducive to business. If a benefic is in a cadent house, the beneficence of the planet is turned away from the native (or native?s agenda). This placement is generally good for malefic.

b) Conditions relative to Sun:

When a planet is in the interval from heliacal rising up to first station or from second station up to the heliacal setting, the planet is again in a place conducive to conduct its business as it is capable of appearing.

When a planet is making a phasis, it is not only capable of appearing but also highly intensified (like having an exclamation mark on it, for good or worse). [Phasis means ?making an appearance? or ?sudden dramatic showing of something?. It can also mean something that speaks or we can say that it means ?an appearance that speaks?]. Phasis is an astronomical phenomenon where a planet makes a heliacal rising (standardized to 15 degrees by Hellenistic astrology) within 7 days before of after native?s birth.

When a planet is ?under the sun?s beams? i.e. within 15 ecliptic degrees of the sun, the planet is drained or empowered ? hence not capable of conducting its business.

When a planet is in the interval of first station to second station (i.e. retrograde), the planet is not fit to conduct its business because it is practically walking backwards.

c) Conditions relative to the zodiac:

When a planet is in one of its own places (domicile, exaltation or bound/term), it is also able to conduct its business.

Note: If a planet is in a place of his sect mate (planet's dispositor = another planet of same sect, please see below for the Hellenistic definition of sect), it also has some fitness/ability to conduct its business although it has to use that other planet?s resources. For example, the diurnal sect planets are Sun, Jupiter and Saturn, so if Jupiter is in the domicile/exaltation/bounds of Sun or Saturn, Jupiter is still able to conduct its business (although he has to rely on Sun or Saturn for support).

Schmidt also says that a planet in his own place (in domicile rulership or exaltation or bounds/terms) is like one who travels in a shaded chariot, hence it can be effective or able to conduct its busines even if it is combust.

Conditions that relate to whether the business conducted by the planets is favorable or unfavorable

a) Conditions relative to the horizon:

If a planet is in a house (whole sign) configured (aspected) to the ascendant (whole sign) i.e. if a planet is in house 1, 3, 4, 5, 7, 9, 10 and 11, the planet is said to manifest its favorable significations to the native.

If a planet is in a house (whole sign) in aversion to the ascendant i.e. house 2, 6, 8 and 12, the planet is said to manifest its unfavorable significations to the native.

Examples:
A planet in 8th house. It is fit to conduct its business but unfavorable (8th house of the Idle House in Hellenistic astrology).

Planet in the 7th house. It is fit and favorable but more favorable to others rather than to the native (as 7th house is in opposition to the first).

b) Conditions relative to Sun:

When a planet is in sect, it is favorable to the native. When a planet is out of sect, it is unfavorable to the native. Diurnal planets (Sun, Jupiter and Saturn) are favorable in diurnal charts and unfavorable in nocturnal charts. Nocturnal planets (Moon, Venus and Mars) are favorable in nocturnal charts and unfavorable in diurnal charts.

According to Schmidt, (unlike medieval definition of sect), sect is simply determined from the chart itself. For diurnal charts, Sun, Jupiter and Saturn are in sect and Venus, Moon and Mars are contrary to sect. For nocturnal charts, Venus, Moon and Mars are in sect and Sun, Jupiter and Saturn are contrary to sect. The other definitions of sect (those you find in Medieval Astrology) are rejoicing conditions.

Benefic of the sect (Jupiter in diurnal chart and Venus in nocturnal chart) is really good

Malefic contrary to sect (Saturn in nocturnal chart and Mars in diurnal chart) is really bad

Benefic contrary to sect: Cannot pursue its own agenda. Best function is that of loyal opposition

Malefic of the sect: The destructiveness of the malefic can be used for the native (instead of against him)

c) Conditions relative to the zodiac:
Similar to the judgment of fitness of a planet but it also involves benefic/malefic nature.

Note: ?No planet in its own place, even a malefic, is not without a measure of beneficence?

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Great stuff, astrojin!

Please, go on writing...although I don't understand everything, I'm sure you'll explain those missing bits and pieces along the way, as you proceed. :D

I'm really grateful to you for sharing this knowledge with all of us and I'm sure the others feel the same way.

Greetings,
Cor Scorpii

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that?s very kind of you, Astrojin.

I have some questions about these "laws".
Malefic contrary to sect (Saturn in nocturnal chart and Mars in diurnal chart) is really bad
Suppose I have Mars ruling my Ascendent in a daytime chart. As a malefic out of sect, does mars harms my life even ruling my Asc or good houses? Does the greeks proceeded the same way as the medievals in analysing house rulers?
Benefic contrary to sect: Cannot pursue its own agenda. Best function is that of loyal opposition
In practical terms, what can be a "loyal opposition"?
Rodolfo Veronese, CMA.
http://www.astrosphera.blogspot.com

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Hi Rodd,
Suppose I have Mars ruling my Ascendent in a daytime chart. As a malefic out of sect, does mars harms my life even ruling my Asc or good houses? Does the greeks proceeded the same way as the medievals in analysing house rulers?
First of all, I can't really say what a Hellenistic astrologer would say (I am not what you called a pure Hellenistic astrologer!). I am just reporting as what I have read/learnt... My approach is more eclectic.

In Vedic astrology (an opinion also shared by some medieval astrologers), the function of a planet (good or bad) is also judged by the house it rules. I have to disgree with this (at least for the moment). When a planet rules a house, it is doing just that. If I am given a job to rule prison (12th house), I myself can still do good or bad. Similarly with the planets. The condition of the ruler is more important.

There are 3 primary conditions to consider whether a planet is favorable or unfavorable to the native.

You have Mars in day chart, hence your Mars is out of sect, giving him slightly more aberrant but this is only one of the conditions. At the same time your Mars could be in its own domicile or exaltation or term and not in one of the houses in aversion to the ascendant. There are also other modifying conditions to look at e.g. aspect, planetary phases, etc. AND in Hellenistic astrologer, the ruler of ascendant is not necessarily the most important planet in a chart (we have the predominator, oikodespotes and kurios to look into!).

Re: Hellenistic Astrology - Preliminary Natal Analysis

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astrojin wrote:If a planet is in an angular or succedent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place conducive to conduct its business.

If the planet is also angular by dynamic house system e.g. Prophyry, the planet is said to be goaded towards more activity.

If a planet is in a cadent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place not conducive to business. If a benefic is in a cadent house, the beneficence of the planet is turned away from the native (or native?s agenda). This placement is generally good for malefic.
Hi astrojin and thank you for sharing so generously the knowledge you've got. Especially the above got my attention, because I've just recently done a statistical study about angular and cadent positions of planets comparing quadrant and whole sign houses (both tropical and sidereal). In that study quadrant houses show a clearly stronger and more logical effect - the tropical whole sign houses give weakest results.

The study can be found here on my site
http://koti.welho.com/jmetsovu/criminal ... rators.htm

Naturally traditional rulerships are in use throughout the study. After I had put the study on the net, I checked out the diurnal and nocturnal charts of the sex offenders separately, and yes, the diurnal (out of sect) Mars gave still stronger an effect!

Best, Sari

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A very intereresting study Sari. It's probably worth making an additional note in the news section about this (so that comments can be made that don't distract from this thread). I was curious about whether you thought of testing how a 5 degree misplacement of the house cusps might affect the results?

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Hi Deb and thank you for your feedback! You wrote:
I was curious about whether you thought of testing how a 5 degree misplacement of the house cusps might affect the results?
I don't know how to test this. I made this study mainly by transferring the data to Jigsaw and letting it calculate the results, so it was quite a simple procedure as such. I have been hoping that these research programs (AstroDatabank and Jigsaw) would include the option of using offsets to the house cusps (the so called five degree rule) to their programs; of course it would be more effective to suggest it straight to the makers of the programs. I'll put a note of the article on the News section.

Re: Hellenistic Astrology - Preliminary Natal Analysis

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Papretis wrote:
astrojin wrote:If a planet is in an angular or succedent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place conducive to conduct its business.

If the planet is also angular by dynamic house system e.g. Prophyry, the planet is said to be goaded towards more activity.

If a planet is in a cadent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place not conducive to business. If a benefic is in a cadent house, the beneficence of the planet is turned away from the native (or native?s agenda). This placement is generally good for malefic.
Hi astrojin and thank you for sharing so generously the knowledge you've got. Especially the above got my attention, because I've just recently done a statistical study about angular and cadent positions of planets comparing quadrant and whole sign houses (both tropical and sidereal). In that study quadrant houses show a clearly stronger and more logical effect - the tropical whole sign houses give weakest results.

The study can be found here on my site
http://koti.welho.com/jmetsovu/criminal ... rators.htm

Naturally traditional rulerships are in use throughout the study. After I had put the study on the net, I checked out the diurnal and nocturnal charts of the sex offenders separately, and yes, the diurnal (out of sect) Mars gave still stronger an effect!

Best, Sari
Thanks it is through thse studies that astrology makes progress,not by quoting authorities like Rob Schmitz

Re: Hellenistic Astrology - Preliminary Natal Analysis

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Papretis wrote:
astrojin wrote:If a planet is in an angular or succedent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place conducive to conduct its business.

If the planet is also angular by dynamic house system e.g. Prophyry, the planet is said to be goaded towards more activity.

If a planet is in a cadent house (whole sign), the planet is in a place not conducive to business. If a benefic is in a cadent house, the beneficence of the planet is turned away from the native (or native?s agenda). This placement is generally good for malefic.
Hi astrojin and thank you for sharing so generously the knowledge you've got. Especially the above got my attention, because I've just recently done a statistical study about angular and cadent positions of planets comparing quadrant and whole sign houses (both tropical and sidereal). In that study quadrant houses show a clearly stronger and more logical effect - the tropical whole sign houses give weakest results.

The study can be found here on my site
http://koti.welho.com/jmetsovu/criminal ... rators.htm

Naturally traditional rulerships are in use throughout the study. After I had put the study on the net, I checked out the diurnal and nocturnal charts of the sex offenders separately, and yes, the diurnal (out of sect) Mars gave still stronger an effect!

Best, Sari
Hi
In what side of thew angles was Mars strongest? Near the cusp, on the side of next house,inside, more than 5 degrees away from cusp away?

thanks