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The origin and basis for essential dignities...

1 by Saturnbuffoon
Hi everyone,

I've been studying the sections about the essential dignities in Ashmand's translation of Ptolemy's "Tetrabiblos", and having difficulty figuring out why he divided the terms the way he did.
Does anyone have any answers to this, and, if one is to become good at horary astrology, is it really that important to know the terms. In other words, could one make accurate judgements without them? Did astrologers like Lilly use them?
I would be thankful if anyone has any ideas on this subject.

Respectfully, Peter

3 by yuzuru
That few astrologers use the terms is not a measure of theis "unimportance".
very few astrologers use the arabic parts, the profection, the firdaria, and all things that are not 20th century fads like asteroids and midpoints.
So, this is not a criteria for rejection of the terms.

The terms are a very important piece of judgement, both in natal and in horary
Meu blog de astrologia (em portugues) http://yuzuru.wordpress.com
My blog of astrology (in english) http://episthemologie.wordpress.com

4 by Tom
The terms are not indisputably defined. There are several systems.
The same can be said for the houses.

Most astrologers don't use them because most astrologers are not familiar with them. Most astrologers don't do horary or elections either. As yuzuru says, popularity is not the same as being effective.

The terms are not the most powerful of dignities, but they can be surprisingly influential. Take note when a planet changes terms in a nativity by direction or progression for example.

As for the "why" the terms are divided as they are, no one knows for sure. Just as no one knows for sure where the exaltations came from. See Lee Lehman's book Essential Dignities for a full discussion of the terms.

Tom

5 by Saturnbuffoon
Hi again,

Thanks for your input. John Frawley apparently agrees, as he writes on pg. 49 of the horary textbook: "I have never seen a convincing explanation of why the terms are as they are. There are several rival arrangements." Then he goes on to say, "This one works," referring, I believe, to Ptolemy's construction and its use in horary.
With regards to the exaltations though, Tom, Ptolemy explains why each planet is exalted in such and such sign, so I'm wondering what you mean that nobody knows the basis for them. Or did you mean nobody knows the basis of the faces? Or perhaps you meant nobody knows where Ptolemy came up with the exaltations? Perhaps, however, this has no relevance to the practical use of the essential dignities, where they are shown to work in practice.
Anyway, thanks for your input as usual.

Peter

6 by Tom
so I'm wondering what you mean that nobody knows the basis for them.
I meant no one knows the origin of the exaltations. They predated Ptolemy and may have been, and in fact probably were some kind of domicile rulership system that predates the one we use now. We just don't know who used them first and why.

Tom

8 by sasha_i
Hello everybody,
Does anyone have any answers to this, and, if one is to become good at horary astrology, is it really that important to know the terms.

Here is a good discussion about this subject masterfully conducted by Deborah :

http://skyscript.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1984

Regarding the nature and use of terms my opinion is:
1. it looks like a synthesis of other dignities, with a specific role in prognostication.
2. we should pay more attention to the ethimological sense of the word horion (the greek origin terminology for ?terms? as Robert Schmidt correctly argued)< greek horion means in English limit, bound.
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