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Football Predictions November 2007
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aquirata



Joined: 31 Mar 2006
Posts: 157
Location: Canada

Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just out of curiosity, I went to Soccerstand and checked the final score for this match: 8-0 for Liverpool! Goals were at 19, 32, 53, 56, 69, 79, 81 and 89 minutes. They were only supposed to score at 45, 53 and 80. In the 32nd minute, L4 into the radical 4th/underdog's 10th had Liverpool score. Nothing happened in the 48th.
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Gem



Joined: 19 Nov 2004
Posts: 954

Posted: Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fantastic Thumbs up 8 goals!!
We didn't need to worry at all Laughing
Incredible that they were beaten in the first round.
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LaurieB



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 47
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands

Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 10:44 am    Post subject: Champions League post mortem Reply with quote

I did all 8 charts yeterday. That is what I always do with multiple games at more or less the same time.
I pick the chart that has the tightest testimony. for betting.

Yesterday I made a big mistake. The Lazio Roma- Werder Bremen game showed clear and tight testimony of the underdog winning.
Lazio was the favourite, but the odds were very close. I think with hindsight that Lazio were only favourites because of home advantage.
So this is a chart that can go both ways, because there really is no discernable difference in strength. I expected Werder to win, as it was the underdog, but Lazio did.

BTW I only use John's method, as I have been doing for years now (AA), and the book makes it all much clearer. I will continue to do so, untill I know the book by heart, before I will look at other methods.

testimony for the underdog:
Moon in 4 (weak, too far from the cups and in a diferent sign;
Ruler of the 1st in 4 (I used Moon's ruler, to keep the Moon for the flow), closer to the cusp, but still a bit far.
Deciding was: Antiscion Lord7 tightly on C10.
But who was really favourite and who was the underdog?
I will leave charts like this well alone in future. It was an expensive lesson Sad

The only game I could actually watch on TV was Olympiakos-Real Madrid, as Dutch TV for some reason decided that would be the most interesting. It wasn't. It was a draw, 0-0. I expected Real to win with difficulty, or a draw.

I expected Liverpool to win and so they did. Much easier than I expected, but who cares Laughing
L7 on c4 was slightly worrying, but if they started a litle late that would not have been a problem at all. Does anybody know what time the match actually started?

FC Porto did as I expected. They won by default option. No testimonies at all.

AC Milan also did as was expected. They won as well and there was strong testimony for them to do so.

Celtic the same.

Chelsea dito.

It is the Valencia-Rosenborg game that has me mystified.
I expected Valencia to win by default option, especially as the odds were enormously in their favour. I could have made a fortune, but alas....
Rosenborg won, 0-2. And there was absolutely no testimony for it. At least not that I could see. Lord 7 was 3 degrees before c4, so unless the game started about 10 minutes early....
There is aboslutely nothing else! Unless we resort to quincunxes and use the MC: Lord 7 opposite MC (3 degrees away) and Moon quincunx MC, but I am not willing to consider those just yet. I will keep it in mind though for another time. This is one of those mystifying charts that I keep in a separate drawer to look at some times and hope for a revelation or divine insight Mad

I will post my predictions for tonight separately.
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Ficina
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Joined: 26 Mar 2004
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Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting analyses, Laurie. Sorry you lost on the Lazio game Sad

I've had a quick look at tonight's charts before I go out. The Moon conj Mercury is interesting because in five cases it favours the underdogs. There's also Moon opp antiscion Saturn. I give the Asc to the home team btw.

Look forward to seeing others' views. Wonder if we'll see another 8 goals anywhere Shocked Very Happy
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leeleelee



Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 79

Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am equally puzzled with Valencia's game, in fact there were some testimonies for the favorites to win: Pluto antiscion near 7th cusp + L1 Venus applying sextile to POF antiscion (although JF says conjunction only) + Uranus Rx applying to MC.

Porto and Milan's victory was justified, so is the draw for RM. I did not see anything on Liverpool winning and I expected Chelsea to win Sad

Moon Via Combusta for tonight's game, I don't think JF mentioned anything about this in the book. Do you think it will have any effects?

Tonight, I think:
Roma
Slavia Prague (not to lose)
Rangers (not to lose)

Looking forward to seeing more predictions from you guys!
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LaurieB



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 47
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands

Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 12:29 pm    Post subject: Post mortem Liverpool + predictions CL tonight Reply with quote

I expected Liverpool to be all right. They were the favourites and there was no real testimony against them, so the default option applied. I did not expect them to win so convincingly, though!

When there are so many games at the same time, there are usually many that have the same testimony, like Ficina said about tonight's games, where the Moon conjuncts Mercury and Mercury is a significator for the underdogs in many games (Lord 4). Normally one doesn't see the underdogs win in all these games. The difference being the difference in strength, I always thought. Now I am not so sure anymore, after Rosenborg Sad
So some of these games the underdogs win, some end in a draw and some the favorites are expected to win, especially when hey are much stronger than the underdogs. I will consider Rosenborg an exception and continue with balancing the strengths.

First let us consider the games that have Mercury as one of the significators. There are 5.
Then there are the games that have Saturn as one of the significators, as the Antiscion of Saturn is at 23.00 Aries, and the Moon apllies to opposite it. There are 7. In fact, all but Sporting- AS Roma.

Sporting-AS Roma have Mercury as Lord1, so atrong testimony for the favorites to win, as Moon conjoins Mercury. In this case also the Antiscion of Fortuna is in 1, so even stronger. Question is: who is the favorite? The odds are very close; 2.75 to 2.45 The same as the Lazio-Werder Bremen game...... But the difference is that AS Roma is not favourite because of home advantage, as they are playing in Portugal, so I might just be lucky and the favorites (AS Roma) do win.

There are 5 games that have strong testimony for the favorites, as they have both the conjunction of the Moon to Mercury, Lord 4, as the opposition of the Moon to antiscion Lord7.
These are:
Slavia Prag - Arsenal
Inter Milan -CSFK Moscow
Manchester U- Dynamo Kiev
Barcelona-Glasgow Rangers
Olympiques-Stuttgart

Of these the strongest testimony is for the ManchesterU-Dynamo Kiev game. The difference in odds is tremendous; 1.15 - 17.00. Roughly 15 to 1, but the testimonies for Dynamo are strong. Not just the Moon/L4 conjunction, and the Moon opp.AntiscionL7, but also L7 closest to c4.
However Antiscion Moon is applying to conjunct the MC, and the antiscion of Fortuna trines the MC. So unless I am very much mistaken, the favorites will win, but not without a struggle. Probably Dynamo will score 2 times, or something like that. Maybe even a draw...

There is another game where the difference in strength is tremendous:
Barcelona-Glasgow Rangers. About 11-1. Apart from the 2 testimonies for the underdog, we have here Uranus R applying to c10. I think we can safely say that Barcelona will win, as Uranus slightly favours the favourites.

Slavia Prag-Arsenal. Roughly 4 : 1. Strong evidence for the underdog; not just the two shared testimonies, but also L1 just inside c4. (I use Dispositor of the Moon for L1). I think Slavia Prag will win or maybe a draw.... (the difference in odds considering).

Olympique L.-Stuttgart:
2 shared testiomonies for the underdogs,
Antiscion Fortuna just before c1, conjunct Mars which is closely apllying to asc. ...
John considers house placement first and Moon's aspects later. based on this I would think Olympiques will have a hard time winning, but they will win (or a draw, maybe).

Fenerbahce-PSV is the game I am most interested in, as PSV is the only Dutch team still left in the CL. But in this game only on of the testimonies for the underdog is present (PSV is the underdog, roughtly 1:2).
There is also testimony for the favourites, Moon trine Antiscion Fortuna.
Hopefully a draw, but I feel Moon trine AFortuna may be stronger than Moon opposite A7. I will go for a draw, though, for sentimental reasons.

Last game: Steaua Bucaresti - Sevilla;
Same testimonies as the Fenerbahce-PSV game, so also a draw or fav. to win.

That's all for now. I cannot always spend so much time on my hobbies Smile
Work to do!
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Gem



Joined: 19 Nov 2004
Posts: 954

Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 1:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven`t read JF`s book so it`s very interesting to see his method being demonstrated here by the members. I`m particularly struck by the abundant use of antiscion and the use of the dispositor of the Moon as the main sig in the Cancer/Cap games. What do you do when the Moon is in Aquarius/Capricorn(as Ficina pointed out somewhere)?

Astrology aside, it`s difficult to imagine Arsenal not beating Slavia Plague. I`m going for a easy win for both ManU and Arsenal. The Barcelona/Rangers chart looks interesting. There are testimonies for Rangers but I`m not sure they are strong enough to beat Barcelona.

I haven`t personally seen any effects of Via Combusta; besdies, it`s applying to Spica so it should be all right.
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leeleelee



Joined: 29 Sep 2007
Posts: 79

Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Odds for Sporting vs Roma, volatile. It is hard to determine who is the favourite now. So we throw in the color method: Sporting = Green/White Stripes, Roma = Orange/Brown. So Sporting gets ASC (Gemini) ?

I think I will pass on this one.
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Ficina
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Joined: 26 Mar 2004
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Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Slavia Prag-Arsenal. Roughly 4 : 1. Strong evidence for the underdog; not just the two shared testimonies, but also L1 just inside c4. (I use Dispositor of the Moon for L1). I think Slavia Prag will win or maybe a draw.... (the difference in odds considering).


This is an interesting one. If we give the home team the Asc, then all the testimonies are in Arsenal's favour. I wonder who gets the Asc using the colour method?

Re the Lazio and Valencia matches yesterday. Again, I'm wondering how the colour method would have panned out. When Leelee did that analysis looking at the three different methods of Asc allocation, the colour method came out on top. (See page 1 of the October Predictions thread.) Such a lot of hard work though. Finding out the team colours and then deciding how they fit, before you even consider what's happening in the chart.
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horarcek



Joined: 24 Jul 2005
Posts: 148
Location: Slovenia

Posted: Wed Nov 07, 2007 8:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Champions League post mortem Reply with quote

LaurieB wrote:


It is the Valencia-Rosenborg game that has me mystified.
I expected Valencia to win by default option, especially as the odds were enormously in their favour. I could have made a fortune, but alas....
Rosenborg won, 0-2. And there was absolutely no testimony for it. At least not that I could see. Lord 7 was 3 degrees before c4, so unless the game started about 10 minutes early....
There is aboslutely nothing else! Unless we resort to quincunxes and use the MC: Lord 7 opposite MC (3 degrees away) and Moon quincunx MC, but I am not willing to consider those just yet. I will keep it in mind though for another time. This is one of those mystifying charts that I keep in a separate drawer to look at some times and hope for a revelation or divine insight Mad

I will post my predictions for tonight separately.



Hi Laurie, (glad to meet you here too Very Happy ),
what do you think about antiscia of L4 very close to North Node?

About position of L7 close to 4th cusp it means (by my opinion) only good playing of underdog and so it isn`t strong testimony for him to win.

Trojan
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LaurieB



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 47
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:48 am    Post subject: post mortem Champions League Reply with quote

Well, me and my big mouth...
I got three totally wrong; two where I expected the underdogs to win, and one where I expected the favourites to win.
I thought Glasgow Rangers might win, or a draw (because of the great difference in strength), but of course Barcelona won. I should have known better at those odds, (1.70 : 14.00) but the Rosenborg game.....
Fenerbahce losing or a draw was wishful thinking; PSV are probably out of the CL now. No testimonies whatsoever in the chart.
Sporting-AS Roma is a mystery. AS Roma were the favourites. Moon applying to conjunct L1 should have made them win, but it was a draw 2-2.
Inter Milan, Olympique, Sevilla and Manchester U. did as expected and Arsenal I thought might lose or a draw, well it was a draw 0-0.

Tonight in the UEFAcup there are 16 games and that is too many for me. I simply don't have the time to do them all. So I will make a selection.
I will post them later on. Any favourites?

In the meantime: do you have any thoughts on why AS Roma did not win?
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Ficina
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Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So six favourites won, five of which were the home teams - pretty much par for the course.

Quote:
do you have any thoughts on why AS Roma did not win?


Leelee pointed out that odds were fluctuating, so presumably Roma were not definite faves at the start of the game. That alone could indicate a draw. However, astrologically speaking, as well as being L1, Mercury was also L4, so the Moon's applying aspect favoured both sides. Laurie, I don't see antiscion POF in 1st. Are you using reversed formula? Antiscion Mercury is just inside 10th, so that would favour Asc team. Apparently Sporting deserved to win the game and were very unlucky to concede a last minute equaliser which was a double deflection.

Quote:
About position of L7 close to 4th cusp it means (by my opinion) only good playing of underdog and so it isn`t strong testimony for him to win.


That's what I used to believe too, Trojan, until seeing the Liverpool game. Besiktas did not play well at all Confused

I've never felt the same enthusiasm for the UEFA cup as I do for the Champions League. However, the Spurs, Bolton and Everton games are all being shown on TV here, so I shall probably take a look at those charts.
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LaurieB



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
Posts: 47
Location: Amsterdam, Netherlands

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:49 am    Post subject: post mortem Champions League Reply with quote

Ficina, I composed a very lengthy reply and then I lost it Sad I cannot handle the quote system yet, apparently.

We were talking about the AS Roma game:
In short: John doesn't use the 4th and 10th if the significtors are the same as the 1st and 7th. I watched charts with them for some time and I agree. So no favouring both teams.

And no, the Antiscion of Fortuna is not in 1. I made a mistake, and you are right, antiscion L1 is just inside the 10th. I missed that. Sloppy! Favorites should have won. Then why didn't they?

All I can think of is Pluto. John says "Pluto seems to hold some kind of grudge against favourites: he's much less inclined to work his malice on the underdog." (SA p90). So the placement of Pluto in the 7th may have been more harmfull for the favourites, especially as antiscionMercury, both L1 and the dispositor of Fortuna, sextiles Pluto.
In the Rosenborg game (another mystery), the antiscion of Venus, dispositor of Fortuna squared Pluto. I may be wrong, but I will keep a very close eye on Pluto for the time being.
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Ficina
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Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
John doesn't use the 4th and 10th if the significtors are the same as the 1st and 7th


Ah, that makes sense - thanks, Laurie.

Quote:
Favorites should have won. Then why didn't they?


No method works 100% of the time? JF makes a couple of comments in his book about this, including the tongue in cheek one about the players not following the script Laughing As you say though, it might be worth keeping an eye on the wretched Pluto.

In tonight's games we have Moon sextile Saturn.

Bayern v Bolton. Moon sextile Saturn (L10), opp ant Mercury (L1). An easy win for Bayern who are odds-on faves.

Hapoel Tel-Aviv v Spurs. Moon aspects are the same, favouring the Asc team, except Moon/Saturn is just over 5 degs. Jupiter (L7) in 7th. Looks like a draw, although Spurs may have the edge being odds-on faves.

Nurnberg v Everton. No clear fave. Moon sextile Saturn (L7). Mars as dispositor of Moon (L1) conj PoF but separating. I'll go for a win for Everton.
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LaurieB



Joined: 06 Nov 2007
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Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I still haven't figured out how to use the nice quotes; so your comments are between ""

"No method works 100% of the time? JF makes a couple of comments in his book about this, including the tongue in cheek one about the players not following the script Laughing As you say though, it might be worth keeping an eye on the wretched Pluto."

I cannot accept a method not working all the time, or, as in this case, to be so totally wrong some of the time
There must be additional testimony not used/noticed yet.

"Hapoel Tel-Aviv v Spurs. Moon aspects are the same, favouring the Asc team, except Moon/Saturn is just over 5 degs. Jupiter (L7) in 7th. Looks like a draw, although Spurs may have the edge being odds-on faves."

This chart looks very much like the Sporting-AS Roma one. Based on this I agree with the draw. The big difference is placement of Fortuna, but that doesn't play a role in either of these two charts, as far as I can see. So draw it is.

I havent'looked at the other charts you mention, I based my 6 choices on the odds. I prefer games were the oods are not almost the same or with a great difference. I go for the middle ground. Let's see if this works better. Unfortunately I cannot spend so much time on them today.
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