Does anyone know much about the Planetary Seals and their numerical tables? Yes, I have read my classical literature on talismanic magic but what do the tables actually mean and how do they work?

I.e. The table of Saturn

4 9 2
3 5 7
8 1 6

or, The table of Jupiter

4 14 15 1
9 7 6 12
5 11 10 8
16 2 3 13

I know some, but I'm not sure what you're asking. Do you want to know how the sigils are derived from the kamea? They're basically from the numerical values of the Hebrew letters corresponding to the numbers according to the Aiq Bekar. Each kamea has a value according to its planet and each planet has an intelligence and a spirit signified by a symbol derived from letter values. The planetary seal is derived from following the numbers in order.

As to whether they work or not...no idea yet. It depends what you mean by "work" and I haven't personally used them much.

If you want to ask something more specific, I'll have a go, but I don't want to post an essay on stuff you already know.

Kim

I can't make heads or tails of how to use the tables. I know how to add up and count, and they are beautiful - but for what purpose, and how do I use them? Can I intergrate them into some mathematical calculations or derive some meaning from them on basis of the positions of the planets? Is there something we have lost or forgotten, or are the numerical tables merely an artistic product of the mathematical?

I don't know much about the history of them, but they are commonly used in magical rituals (or magickal if you prefer ) eg. in doing a ritual to make a Jupiter talisman, you would inscribe the table of Jupiter onto the talismanic object. I have not heard of them being used for any other purpose.

Keren

First of all, the numbers that you have quoted have nothing to do with Saturn or Jupiter.

Some say that Saturn is called Zohul in Arabic and numerical value of Zohul is Zo-h-l (7+8+30)=45, which is the sum total of values from 1 to 9.

The seals of Saturn or Venus or Jupiter, properly belong to remedial astrology or magical astrology. The basis of magical astrology is homeopathic magic, best described by Sir James Frazer in his book Golden Bough.

The seal of 3X3 is used for the purposes of enmity and all affairs, which have to do with Saturn.

The seal of 4X4 is used for the affairs of Jupiter.

It is the form of the seal, 3X3 or 4X4 which is important.

The formula for total is

[(3X3+1)/2]X3=15
[(4X4+1)/2]X4=34
[(5X5+1)/2]X5=65

and so on and on.

Chaldean or Babylonian or Saieebeen (Saibeen is a Muslim term for Chaldean) had a belief that Luminaries and Planets actually represent the Gods who controlled the Universe. Priests pounced on this belief--some say that they were responsible for this belief. Large religious observatories were constructed which are called Ziggurat. Priests of Babylonian culture were the first proper astronomers and astrologers. They maintained extensive records of the movements of the planets. (initially the point of reference for such observations was not zodiac but fixed stars). This astronomical observation gave birth to Astrology of Omens and Mundane astrology.

In order to control the common people (who were the working class) Priests and Kings worked in unison. Priests implanted the belief that Kings had their authority, which were given to them by the Gods.

People were psychologically terrified of Priests, who further worked on the fear of the common people. Priests were able to predict the timing of Eclipses.

Priests developed astrology and told people what was the will of the God (Planet) and to ward of evil influence of a planet or gain favor of a nicer deity. Elaborate remedial measures were used.

These remedial measures are now days called. Talismans, Remedial measures, magical squares.

The basis is quite simple.

Every planet represents or resonates to

-a person
-an animal
-a herb
-a color
-a mineral
-a place
and list can give on and on.

Now supposedly a person wants to gain a sexual favor of a maid.

He would use a statement.

Miss So and SO daughter of so and so should fall in Love with STJ son of so and so. (calculate the numerical value of this statement)

Now, use an appropriate statement from any religious scripture which has something to say about Love (calculate the numerical value)

Add these two.

You have to subtract certain values from the sum total in two ways.

In first instance you arrive at a certain figure which would be converted into alphabets. This represents an angel or an archangel.

In the second instance you will subtract a certain sum and you will arrive at a certain figure which would be converted into alphabets. This represents a name of certain Demon.

Let us now turn back to the original sum (addition of the two). Subtract a certain number and fill it in a square. If the Talisman is intended for enmity. then Seal of Saturn 3X3 is used. If the Talisman is intended for love. then seal of Venus is used. Fill the numbers so that the total comes exactly to the total of addition of two verses.

Then select an appropriate time (according to astrology) when Venus or Jupiter has good aspects with Moon. Or Venus is exalted or Venus is in her own house etc. Moon should not be Void of course.

Moon should have separated from a malefic and applying to a benefic (the rules are some what similar to horary or election astrology.

Select appropriate herbs or incenses.

At the moment of selected time. The seal would be filled with numbers with chanting of verses, invoking the help of demon and angel (an appropriate incense is must).

I have tried to give the essence of the back ground of seals. The remedial procedure is not that simple. I have ommited details for fear of too lengthy post.

The astrologers in past were expected to be able to practice remedial astrology. They diagnosed the problem from astrology and gave the remedy from Talismans or etc.


I hope it helps.

Regards

STJ

The basis of the kameas is kind of simple. The number of squares for each planet is the number of the cabala sphere that the planet rules. Saturn is the third sphere so its kamea has 3 squares up and down. Next is Jupiter at 4, Mars at 5, Sol at 6, Venus at 7, Mercury at 8, and Moon at 9, in the Chaldean order. The number sphere of the planet determines the number of squares across and the number of squares down. For more on cabala you can go here,
http://www.thelemapedia.org/index.php/Tree_of_Life or go here,
http://www.fixedearth.com/Madonna-Kabbala.htm .

To fill the kameas with numbers you:
1. use numbers 1 to the last number of squares. So Saturn at the 3rd sphere makes 3 X 3 squares would fill with 1 to 9. Mars at 5 would fill with numbers 1 to 25 (5 X 5) etc.
2. In magic squares the sum of the numbers in a row going across is the same as the sum of numbers in a column going down. So, do the math and put the numbers in accordingly. Viola, your magic kamea.
3. Sigils are derived by taking the name of the spirt, god, angel, demon, etc.; converting each hebrew letter of their name into a number. and then connecting the dots of the kamea.


some kameas
http://www.conjurer.org/?id=kamea

More on magic squares
http://www.arcane-archive.org/interdisc ... ares-1.php

Good book on making talismans with kameas:
http://www.amazon.com/How-Make-Talisman ... 0850302099

Paul Huson uses the kameas in his fun book: Mastering Witchcraft, and it ain't the white light Wiccan kind either.

Trying to add here, and not repeat. The main use of kamea does seem to be in talismans, although there are numerous methods that specify precisely how you do this. The kamea are inscribed on suitable materials in suitable colours at an elected time. Often, the elections seem to be a simple as choosing the right planetary day and hour.

One interesting use of the kamea and seals together is to block negative effects of a planet. For example, during a retrograde Mercury, you lay the seal of Mercury face down on the Mercury kamea.

They were also used back in the 9th century to help in calculating horoscopes and as a predictive tool. In Tibetean astrology, the mewas (the possible Saturn squares) are used that way. Like this

http://www.astrologysoftware.com/resour ... asp?ID=161

http://www.berzinarchives.com/web/en/ar ... ce_01.html

www.heluo.nl/articles/9SDPaGE.pdf

The inference is that Moslem astrologers did a similar thing, but I don't know any details. Anyone know Ibn Ezra well enough to comment?

Kim

Thanks for your great entries which gives a lot to digest. I think I am trying to make up my mind as to whether the magic tables have a mere sympathetic meaning or whether they are a part of predictive astrology.

In my world it makes sense to wear a certain perfume or clothes of a specific colour; I can apply tools of a certain metal, perform actions at a chosen hour or under the aspects of a selected planets. I have yet to understand what use will come of waving with a sheet of paper with numbers jotted down in certain sequence. The receipt does not cure the patient.

Do we find the magic tables expressed in arcitecture or art? I do find them very intriguing, but I am still slightly mystified.

Do we find the magic tables expressed in arcitecture or art?

Durer's Melancholia
http://www.princeton.edu/~his291/Durer_Melancolia.html

Dante's Commedia http://hometown.aol.com/genesisformulae ... trix5.html

Sagrada Familia, Barcelona
http://www.markfarrar.co.uk/gzimmerman01.htm

Are the ones that spring to mind. As for architecture, yes, but I'm certainly no expert on that. You'd find material under "sacred geometry" or scared architecture."

Kim

This simply gets better and better. Would I then be correct in assuming that the squares were a way of conveying a secret message?

Human beings have a wonderful ability to create thought forms in the astral world, while he is in this material world. These thought forms (Demons-Angels for Talismans) are task specific.


Planetary seals are coded instructions for the thought forms.

That's OK - as long as we are not only talking dream world. Too much astral stuff can really get you down sometimes and seem like a poor excuse for something that doesn't really work, seen from the outside...

No critisism intended.