Lilith some observations

[Zosma]

It may help others to understand lilith if I share recent events.
Lilith transiting my ruling planet Mercury in Pisces which is combusted by the Sun which is cazimi dark moon lilith in natal chart Square Mars in gemini
Jupiter in sag & opposing pluto in Virgo.
Mercury & Sun by whole sign in the 7th house.So a Cadent cosmic cross in mutable signs.
I was called to do some maintenance work to install hand rails on stairs where
A Mother carrying her child had fallen with child from stairs thankfully no serious damage to anybody.The landlady a Sagittarian accuses her of being
too fat & therefore lacking the agility to negotiate the stairs successfully, which may or may not be true but at least goes too show why Sagittarians lack diplomatic skills Donald Trumps moon springs to mind.
Unfortunately this creates heated arguments & an atmosphere that had there
been a knife thrown it would float on the air the atmosphere was so dense with venom & hatred (Mars gemini square Pluto in 12th house)
I became concerned for the Landlady because I could sense the build up of intense negative psychic energy. Within a week of this event the Landlady was involved in a near fatal car accident Which didn’t suprise me as lilith settled over my mercury I gave her a book to read Beware the power of the evil eye by John H Elliot Vol 1 .I would recommend this book as an introduction to the power of lilith

[Tanit3333]

Hi Zosma,

[Zosma]

And does the NN conjunct the sun or moon not have a profound effect yet the point is not a planet just a mathematical position. Likewise antiscions are therefore useless because they are shadows devoid of planetary positions ?

[Donna Chang]

[Zosma]

Hi Tanit 3333
Apologies if my reply appeared disrespectful. Thanks for your
considered opinion.
The concept of Cazimi stands on shaky ground there isn’t much
agreement in the old text on this issue.
My Cazimi is with Waldermath lilith & would be grateful if anybody would share their knowledge should they have Waldermath Cazimi the Sun especially if it is in Pisces or the 12th house & part of an aspect pattern or aspecting Neptune
Then we can nail this Cazimi enigma
Waldermath Cazimi in my chart has had a massive effect in my life & I feel sure the effects will reverberate in a similar way to the owners of such charts

[Tanit3333]

Hi Zosma - I am sorry, but I don't see how your example sheds light on a cazimi intepretation for the Black Moon Lilith (or some other Lilith). Partile conjunction seems a sufficient way to categorize the influence. Demophilus did say that cazimi adds to malefic influences (and strengthens beneficial ones), so you could say it might augment an already difficult influence, but that would be considered as Mars and Saturn, generally speaking. I don't like it when people use traditional terms in a modern influence without any basis behind it. For example, are we going to start assigning essential dignities to Black Moon Lilith too when it isn't a planetary body? We would not do that for points in a chart, such as an ascendant, lots, etc.

I may be suffering from the Dunning-Kruger Effect here but I feel like we need a lot more information before accepting these types of interpretations/anecdotal observations.

[Zosma]

Hi Tanit 3333

Yes thanks for that, I do believe Demophilus, to be correct in that regard.
Delphine Gloria Jay in her book interpreting Lilith gives it an exaltation in Gemini,
As regards my "Cazimi"it is overpowering the Sun & a drain on my energy.
It is on the descendant & connects with my wife who has a natural ability to link with the unseen realms. It has a strong connection to the Goddess this explains its strength in the third house.It's symbol is a circle with a diameter line through it this I mentioned in my previous post where the goddess asked me what do I understand by Pi ...which is the relationship of the diameter to the circle.
It symbolises all the negative entities which feed on human fears/hatreds as Rudolf Steiner tried to explain in his teachings.This links to the incident I related at the beginning involving the car crash & the build-up of energies
With Lilith over the Sun it can represent the evil eye which most people in the West take as a pinch of salt but it has been believed in since ancient times.
And I believe some people have a genetic ability to generate this force.It being on the Seventh cusp in my nativity & part of a cosmic cross through the cadent houses & with zosma on the ascendant both myself & my partner have been on the receiving end of this force.
So I am sensitive to this energy & have helped others to deflect it.
Hopefully someone will write of their experiences of a cazimi lilith or even a sun
on algol which can give similar energies though not as intense.

[Zosma]

It seems Lilith exactly conjunct the sun is a very rare occurance as nobody has owned up to having this conjunction in their chart,so it seems I am privileged or cursed to having this at my birth time & indeed,I must be uniquely privileged to comment on this exact conjunction which occurs in Pisces in my natal chart opposing Pluto in the 12th house.
So I will go over some observations on this little understood archetype,
With Lilith in Pisces opposing Pluto in the 12th house one experience that comes to mind is when she showed herself to me during sleeping, My dream during my sleep cycle was pushed aside by a force beyond my control the dream was like a scene on a stage play & it was rolled away to reveal Lilith seated in my room observing me from a distance as I regained waking consciousness I noticed she was still in the room as I awoke.
The shock of this experience upon awakening caused me to leap out of my bed & to switch on the light & Lilith slowly faded as a result of the illumination.
I decided to switch on the radio as I thought this would ground me from my sleep consciousness to everyday awareness, on the radio at that moment was Cliff Richard singing shes just a devil woman with evil on her mind.
In the morning at breakfast my brothers commented that in the middle of the night they had awoke with vampiric woman in their beds looking into their eyes they also jumped out of bed in shock & switched on the lights to see the women slowly fade away.
I believe that Lilith was at that time contemplating how to get past my guardian angel to kill me but the protection was too strong.
When Uranus transited my sun /Lilith conjunction I had some serious problems & was advised that abandoning my country of birth was one solution, for the first time in my life I had felt like a fugitive & abandoned.
Sun conjunct Lilith in the seventh my wife abandoned her country to be with me.
Sun conjunct Lilith beware the evil eye you may have problems one after another outside of the laws of probability your energy will be drained,look to the position of the sign ruler to determine who is responsible.
It is interesting that my early comments on Lilith caused anger from female administrators with anger & claims of disrespect,
Despite what many astrologers claim that Lilith can be redeemed into our psyche I don't believe she can as she has a pre biblical hatred of Adams seed they forget that humans are on the lower rungs of the created hierarchy.

[jac]

I don't think she'd reveal herself without good reason.
It benefits all of us to consider the sources of the histories we're left. If Lilith held such all-consuming contempt for all things male, why would she show herself to you?

I've always interpreted Lilith as fleeing out of disdain for her treatment. To obtain a docile female who would acquiesce to his type of advances, they had to remove part of Adam. Quite a lot to be read into this.

Take it in the spirit in which it was intended.

[Zosma]

Hi Jac
I don’t believe she woke me rather I believe my guardian angel or alcocoden removed the dream scene from my mind to alert me to danger. When I related this incident to a spiritual gifted individual who often received messages which had been proven to be valid in the past. The message she received was that you are lucky to still be here & that night I met with pure evil.
With sun exactly conjunct lilith it was switching on the light which caused her to fade & vanish from sight.
I believe that these planetary archetypes operate like the ancient gods in that they seem to have an individuality but at the same time have a dominion a bit like the Babylonian gods of old.

[jac]

How unfortunate! Well, I'm glad you had protection.
Your brother's experience corroborating yours certainly underlines this.

I'm sure there are those who know where we'll find our respective nemesis-
(heh; checking the spelling of that and discovering that Nemesis is the goddess of divine retribution and revenge) continuing, it sure isn't me!

Far as planetary archetypes, seems they're still here.

Zosma, run a google search on Lilith conjunct Sun natal, a number of things appear. Personally, I find the astro codex unnervingly accurate and useful.

Rereading your post, 12th house sure fits. I don't have cazimi, but the drain on your energy sounds vampiric. I also find your thread very interesting as I believe too much is lost to time.

Subjectively, one (and many do) can add imagined dignities to anything I'd guess, but what will stand the test of time? I sometimes explore relationships with fixed stars.

Thank you for the recommendation of Elliot's book. To say a brief review opened a can of worms would be an understatement.

Have you looked into what was transiting to draw down such nasty energy on said landlady? Sagittarius is nothing if not provocative. Hope this helps a little.

[Zosma]

Hi Jac
Thanks for your contribution,
Whilst the subjects is still fresh in my mind,I have noticed that if you research which films were released at the time of birth.Then the archetypal themes in the storyline are also prevalent in the natives life. I have done some research on close friends & found this to be true, although this is only anecdotal evidence but each individual can try it for themselves to uncovered if there is truth in this concept.Theoretically there should be, because the planetary energies will be acting on the collective unconscious of the masses some people born of that moment will share in the energies.
3 days before my birth Disney released Sleeping beauty in New York, with the storyline of Maleficent not being welcomed at a christaining & uttering a curse causing the abandonment of the baby child in a forest to be looked after by three fairies [could be read as the triple goddess.]so on her 16th birthday she pricked her finger & fell into a sleep state.Throughout this disney production there are many archetypal themes to unmine as regards my life & Lilith which is so closely linked to Maleficent as to be uncanny.
The second close resemblance of Lilith from literary/media sources is Jezebel from the Old Testament,the prophet Elijah was so fightened of her retribution that he prayed to God to end his life rather than face her wrath.
But then again maybe a should not think on her as I have been told that this just draws her to me.

[jac]

You're most welcome Zosma.
Let's hope the New Years finds you comfortable resolution!

There are several representations of Lilith. All bad.
I can't help but be suspicious as what we have from history shows abject contempt for independent women. That much, I KNOW is wrong.

By all means, protect yourself, but we're not getting the whole story.

[Zosma]

My horoscope is full of aspect lines a great big ugly cross interfacing a great big grand trine jupiter on the IC on the sacred babylonian degree/ 7 degrees of sidereal Scorpio, bang between the scorpion's eyes.
This is a connection with the divine feminine of the land,I knew this not to be a philosophical concept but a real being with whom I had a connection maybe because of my connection to the land.
On the great solar eclipse in August 2017 my partner & I traveled to our sacred land with the intention of connecting with the great Mother for protection ritualizing our intent.We waited for a sign that the moment was right to begin,we waited & waited . My Partner turned her head looked at the sky and said the time is now,up above the clouds turned into a replica of my horoscope a circle over a cross.We began the ritual, rainbows appeared as we concluded.
19 months later as the full moon the cycle was completed the intention was actualized.Our protection was completed Woe betide anyone who had the evil intent the rebound was immediate. Maybe this was why Lilith hesitated that fateful night Jupiter on the IC right between the scorpions eyes.
So the matter is concluded

[jac]

We all occupy our respective universe(s).