Black Moon Lilith, Moon's Apogee.

[Fleur]

I am only referring to the Moon's Apogee here. I get very confused by the naming system whether it is the Dark Moon or the Black Moon....and I definitely don't mean the asteroid.

The one I mean is the one Astrodienst use in their ephemeris. I have observed it for a while and it seems to be significant. What does this Black Moon Lilith actually mean? What does it mean in our charts, and when it transits to our charts?

Who first started using it? Is it traditional, or a recent thing?

[Michael Sternbach]

I did include Lilith in chart interpretation for awhile. I recall the case of a young woman suffering from chronic stomach aches. I could find no other indication of this in her chart than Lilith in close conjunction with her Cancer Moon (Cancer being linked to the stomach in the melothesic man).

Lilith represents a dark feminine side of ours. I generally consider Lilith's natal position to indicate an area in which we are needy and demanding. This is not to say that nothing constructive can come from it, to be sure. Sometimes we must go deep underground in order to lift a hidden treasure...

I do think Lilith is more of a modern addition, along with asteroids and centaurs etc. Not indispensable in practice, but sometimes providing some valuable insight.
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[Fleur]

Surely the Moon's Apogee is significant in the same way as the Moons Nodes? Far more important than some asteroid?

Interesting about the Cancer Moon conjunct Lilith causing stomach pain. I haven't studied Lilith enough in natal charts, I was mostly looking at transits of Lilith and how she modifies, actually reverses, the otherwise effects of major transits, as can the Moons Nodes.

[Raymond Scott]

Juan Revilla is one of the astrologers that influenced me in regards to my interest in centaurs and transneptunian objects when I became interested in them 18 years ago.

He is an astronomically oriented astrologer like Zane Stein, Jonathan Dunn, and Philip Sedgwick who are other astrologers that influenced me in regards to my interest in centaurs and transneptunian objects.
He wrote an insightful article about Lilith and the Black Moon. His view is that the Osculating Lunar Apogee (aka True Black Moon) and not the Mean Lunar Apogee (aka Mean Black Moon) that fits the symbolism of Lilith.

He wrote that the round movement of the Mean Lunar Apogee is not a good representative of the nocturnal and magic demoness Lilith. He points out that the roundness and steady motion belongs to the Sun and is alien to the world of the Moon.

He points out that some people reject the Osculating Lunar Apogee in favor of the Mean Lunar Apogee because it makes no sense to them to have it swing as much as 30 degrees from the mean position and have abrupt and irregular changes of velocity and direction, but he thinks that it is precisely this erratic behavior that makes the Osculating Lunar Apogee the best representative of the irrational, instinctive, and primal symbolism of Lilith.

He points out that , the Black Moon (he is referring to only Osculating Lunar Apogee) is astronomically an isolated point, a point of neglect, repression, fermentation, and "magical" transformations that belong to a phantasmal,nocturnal, and instinctive/erotic world. He wrote that it contains all the more instinctual energies (including the atavistic wisdom and clairvoyance, which is dependent on bodily functions) deep within the psyche, of which sexuality is of course paramount, and which manifest themselves in fairy tales and in primitive lunar symbolism: the night, the mystery, the magic, the danger, the secret, the fear, that which is forbidden.

He wrote that the Black Moon takes hold of our emotions. He wrote that it is a reactive point, never a point of integration, and so it can cause strong identifications or very powerful projections of unconscious emotions which may not be recognized as such. His feeling is that the Black Moon always works at this reactive level.

He wrote that the traditional negative or "demonic" associations of Lilith are rejected as being the result of the Judeo-Christian "male superiority" and "ego" ideologies. He said that this doesn't change to him the fact that there are still many demons inside of both men and women, and that the world of the night with all its mystery and magic still exists, although in areas and in ways different from those of the past.


I have an interest in the Osculating Lunar Apogee because it's prominent in my chart.
Osculating Lunar Apogee in 5'42 Scorpio Retrograde
conjunct Sun in 5'20 Scorpio


I guess that I am Black Moon Lilith Man.
I view it as as challenge instead of a gift.
I admit that I have strong feminine traits even though I am not homosexual nor transgender.

My Sun-Osculating Lunar Apogee conjunction has connections to transneptunian dwarf planet/candidates for its conjunct:

conjunct Ixion in 5'25 Scorpio
conjunct South Eris Node in 5'30 Scorpio