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I agree with Curtis that Hellenistic dignities were not weighted -- I have not seen numerical systems "weighing" the dignities before the early Arabic period (700-800 CE). Also, I am not sure that we can resolve essential digities into quality and accidental dignities neatly into quantity. Some of the rather charming descriptions from astrologers such as Bonatti and Ibn Ezra, for example the idea that a planet in its own house is "like a lord in his manor" and an exalted planet is like "an honored guest," seem to have their roots in such qualitative judgment as the Hellenistic term for detirmented planets as being in "exile" (far from home, perhaps punished in a certain way, as when Ovid was exiled to the Black Sea for fooling around with Augustus' daughter).

But sometimes accidental dignities could be qualitative as well. Unfortunatley, I am traveling and far from my library and don't have the exact reference, but see Antigonus of Nicea's interpretation of Hadrian's horoscope, wherein he uses the heliacal rising of (I think) Venus and the Moon to tell us some personal details about the women in Hadrian's life. So this is more than just "strength" or "ability to act" (or, to use Schmidt's term, "to conduct business"). Accidental dignities can be just as qualitative as essential ones.

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Kenneth Johnson wrote:
But sometimes accidental dignities could be qualitative as well. Unfortunatley, I am traveling and far from my library and don't have the exact reference, but see Antigonus of Nicea's interpretation of Hadrian's horoscope, wherein he uses the heliacal rising of (I think) Venus and the Moon to tell us some personal details about the women in Hadrian's life. So this is more than just "strength" or "ability to act" (or, to use Schmidt's term, "to conduct business"). Accidental dignities can be just as qualitative as essential ones.
Hello Kenneth,

I find it interesting that you chose solar phase as an example of when an accidental dignity is qualitative.

One could argue solar phase is an essential dignity. Ptolemy certainly considered it as such. He proposed solar phase as the 5th essential dignity.
In general the mode of domination is considered as falling under these five forms: when it is trine, house, exaltation, term, and phase or aspect; that is, whenever the place in question is related in one or several or all of these ways to the star that is to be the ruler. Tetrabiblos 3.2
Ptolemy did not use face (decans) as an essential dignity and some medieval astrologers such as Montulmo followed this example.

Personally, though I dont think the essential/accidental dignity distinction is really that helpful in this context of quality vs quantity.

It seems to me that several so called accidental dignities are mostly qualitative in operation. Sect and solar phase immediately come to mind. Houses or places on the other hand seem predominantly quantitative in operation.

I feel its a useful process to think through various accidental dignities and reflect about how they predominantly manifest.

-Sect
-Solar Phase (including combustion)
-Planetary Speed
-Retrograde motion
-House placement
-Aspectual contacts
-Reception
-Fixed Stars
-Nodes
-Lots


Mark
Last edited by Mark on Wed Jan 23, 2013 11:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.
As thou conversest with the heavens, so instruct and inform thy minde according to the image of Divinity William Lilly

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I'd say that some confusion steams from the fact that there is a qualitative dimension to the houses as well (Just like a planet, a house can be interpreted in terms of it's angular position and/or by it's essential meaning). The scheme of the houses goes from most particular (1st house) to most alien (6th house) as I understand it. The idea would be that the closest position analog to life, the rising sign on the horizon, would determine one of the rulers of life itself, alongside the natural rulers such as the Sun and Moon. So, in a way, each angular house represents an element that is closer, the succedents represents something close, and the cadents represents something already distant. Also, If it is a dark house, that tells us about a quality of the house as well. This being said, the reason why a Saturn in 12th would be problematic, is not because it is powerfull to act, but because it is a malefic planet in a dark house, so when it acts, seldom, if ever, any good can come of it. A cadent house is not a sealed house, but a less forcefull one. We live in a world where life is possible, because life is more likely than not, still, in the confines of a chart, death and destruction still lurks, and it will manifest itself at some point.

So, each house, inobstant it's angular power, holds several matters, and among these houses are some that are of a quality contrary to the principle of life. And that is why we call them malefic.

About planetary speed, I think it is elusive, because speed affects how fast something can be done, or put another way, how fast something is "born" to this world. A swift planet will solve it's matters faster, by meeting the light of other planets, while a slower planet will deliver later... I'd enjoy further discussion on this point...
Paulo Felipe Noronha