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Mystery chart February 2019

 
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Michael Sternbach



Joined: 01 Mar 2014
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Posted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 9:53 pm    Post subject: Mystery chart February 2019 Reply with quote

No famous person, just a friend of mine with some rather unconventional background and interests. Looking forward to seeing what you astro tigers are going to figure out...

Psychological insights etc will be welcome as well, of course.

Cheers
Michael


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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
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Posted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks for doing this michael!

some quick thoughts... some type of speech writer for politics - saturn in the 3rd - ruler of ascendant, mercury rising before sun - conjunct pluto/jupiter - mars ruler of midheaven in 9th sign to sun... alternatively - working in finance, or sexual therapist, lol with all that scorpio energy and mars in the 8th.. this is less likely, but hey, thought i would mention it anyway... he seems suited to working behind the scenes with 12th house sun, balsamic sun-moon combo and the sign combo - sag sun and scorpio moon and a saturn in pisces - 12th sign..

it is interesting to see the nodal axis on the midheaven degree.. this usually implies greater publicity and a better known figure.. perhaps this is not the case given the rest of the chart... some type of focus on mercurial activities seem pronounced...

another possibility is working with people that have handicaps, or problems - saturn in pisces - another 12th house-sign type theme... maybe a prison guard, or working with people who have mobility issues - older people...

as you can see, my mind is't extremely focused tonight, lol... after doing that juan guaido thread, i think i am tapped out!

i thing that made me think a bit more about part of fortune is a couple of astro books that i have been looking at, including robert zoellers book and judith hills book on the pof... basically this is one area where they might make money, or get some happiness from.. jupiter/pluto conjunction in scorpio is very close to the pof... ju-pl conjunction is a powerful combo.. in scorpio - the possibility of working in finance increases.. the fellow has 4 planets in scorpio, poor fellow, lol..

anyway, thanks for this exercise.. i might try to offer something more focused in a day or two..

one more thought - chart has all planets contained within the wide mars-saturn opposition.. - mostly an upper hemisphere chart emphasis.. that is mars in the 8th to saturn in the 3rd sort of... they haven't even reached their first saturn return.. things will become more clear for them at that time..

just seeing now how that mars in leo is square the jupiter-pluto-pof conjunction in scorpio.. interesting set up... i will have to think about just what that means... too much of too much on some level!

( this is what a transiting mercury opposite my natal jupiter looks like, lol.)

more - strong interest in psychology - his own, but also in general... perhaps at this point they have studied, or taken some courses in psychology, not that they help! one has to live life in order to gain a fuller perspective on it... this takes time and won't come right away, especially for a person in their 20's! sorry, but that is how i see life working... however, young people can sometimes be very perceptive beyond their years..
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Michael Sternbach



Joined: 01 Mar 2014
Posts: 519
Location: Switzerland

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi James

Thanks for playing along!

Now as 'John Sag' did not exactly recognize himself especially in your initial quick analysis, he further investigated his time of birth. The birth certificate gives a time half an hour earlier (9:00 a.m.), and while this seems to be another approximation to be taken with a grain of salt, I re-post the chart as accordingly corrected:



This shifts the ASC back into Sagittarius (though barely) and also changes some of the positions of the planets in the houses. Overall, it does not seem to affect your previous interpretation very much, however.

So far, I would say that your last remark - regarding the Native's interest in psychology - was rather astute, as he indeed has a keen interest in and spends time studying things pertaining to the psyche, even though more from a spiritual/esoteric angle.

I will also share that he has artistic inclinations that you (or somebody else chiming in) may be able to discern in his chart.

As you remarked, the Native is still quite young, and some of what you suggested may indeed come to bear eventually, although presumably not in time to write Mr. Trump's speeches and/or to act as his sexual therapist. Laughing

That said, the field John is currently 'officially' studying is quite a different one, and it may be possible to see it in the chart (with plenty of ingenuity).

Passing the ball back to you, James! And anybody else with an observation or two - please share.
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Last edited by Michael Sternbach on Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:11 pm; edited 2 times in total
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
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Location: vancouver island

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

michael,

thanks.. obviously the artistic characteristics are strongly pronounced with venus exactly conjunct midheaven in this latest version of the chart.. is there some type of inheritance possibility from the mom, or mothers side? the moon-venus conjunction in scorpio suggests benefit from women in general, but as venus rules the 4th, i wonder about the role the 4th house parent - probably mom - has had on this person?

with sag rising - we now have jupiter in that close conjunction to pluto and mercury, as the ruler of the ascendant.. it also rules sun, and mercury, while mars rules all the scorpio planets.. any time there is a lot of planets in scorpio - there is usually always an interest in the hidden, or psychological aspects to life... moon in scorpio usually has an especially keen interest in this.. it can be for various reasons.. also, the north node is in scorpio. .the jupiter-pluto combo is a powerful combination... just how it manifests in this persons life is hard to know, but profiting from something like a new discovery in medicine, or something presently unknown and secret - could be quite huge.. moon now rules the 8th sign, as opposed to the 7th, so again a focus on others money - finance, inheritance comes to the fore..

i don't have much to say, but am curious to know what the person is actively pursuing, aside from a quick overview on their natal chart!
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Fleur



Joined: 05 Feb 2014
Posts: 769

Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wild guess - a taxidermist?

Or maybe a tattooist?

Or maybe a film makeup artist, who does extreme transformations using makeup?

I don't know exactly where his chart angles are or how close Venus is to his Midheaven....
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map



Joined: 23 Nov 2013
Posts: 42

Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

He might have moved to another country in his childhood. Possible that mother is from another country. He probably has a technical background. I do not rule out pilot / teaching & research. He may be pursuing some studies related to international relations. Govt backed foreign service is also possible. This person is really sincere and hardworking but may be someone has to provide the necessary drive. He will be having interest in complex and hidden subjects like religion, occult studies etc. He will also have artistic talents but that will not take of significantly.
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james_m



Joined: 05 Dec 2011
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Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2019 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

when the ascendant sign and ruler of the ascendant change - that is a big enough change to warrant a very different outlook on the chart in itself... the ascendant ruler is important.. in this case it is now jupiter and it is conjunct the midheaven ruler pluto... this person wants to be, or is a law unto himself and might feel he is above the laws of the ordinary person...and i think they are probably very ambitious too in a driven career oriented way.. it is hard to know what the work is, but something scorpionic would be an obvious guess with the stellium in scorpio... maybe they could be an artist, or an art dealer if they don't believe in themselves... the reason i say that is the mercury-saturn square is sometimes a signature of someone who doesn't have a lot of confidence in their own thoughts... mercury is in the commanding position to saturn however, so maybe this is not a pronounced feature of this person...
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Michael Sternbach



Joined: 01 Mar 2014
Posts: 519
Location: Switzerland

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 8:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

james_m wrote:
thanks for doing this michael!

some quick thoughts... some type of speech writer for politics - saturn in the 3rd - ruler of ascendant, mercury rising before sun - conjunct pluto/jupiter - mars ruler of midheaven in 9th sign to sun... alternatively - working in finance, or sexual therapist, lol with all that scorpio energy and mars in the 8th.. this is less likely, but hey, thought i would mention it anyway... he seems suited to working behind the scenes with 12th house sun, balsamic sun-moon combo and the sign combo - sag sun and scorpio moon and a saturn in pisces - 12th sign..

it is interesting to see the nodal axis on the midheaven degree.. this usually implies greater publicity and a better known figure.. perhaps this is not the case given the rest of the chart... some type of focus on mercurial activities seem pronounced...

another possibility is working with people that have handicaps, or problems - saturn in pisces - another 12th house-sign type theme... maybe a prison guard, or working with people who have mobility issues - older people...

as you can see, my mind is't extremely focused tonight, lol... after doing that juan guaido thread, i think i am tapped out!

i thing that made me think a bit more about part of fortune is a couple of astro books that i have been looking at, including robert zoellers book and judith hills book on the pof... basically this is one area where they might make money, or get some happiness from.. jupiter/pluto conjunction in scorpio is very close to the pof... ju-pl conjunction is a powerful combo.. in scorpio - the possibility of working in finance increases.. the fellow has 4 planets in scorpio, poor fellow, lol..

anyway, thanks for this exercise.. i might try to offer something more focused in a day or two..

one more thought - chart has all planets contained within the wide mars-saturn opposition.. - mostly an upper hemisphere chart emphasis.. that is mars in the 8th to saturn in the 3rd sort of... they haven't even reached their first saturn return.. things will become more clear for them at that time..

just seeing now how that mars in leo is square the jupiter-pluto-pof conjunction in scorpio.. interesting set up... i will have to think about just what that means... too much of too much on some level!

( this is what a transiting mercury opposite my natal jupiter looks like, lol.)

more - strong interest in psychology - his own, but also in general... perhaps at this point they have studied, or taken some courses in psychology, not that they help! one has to live life in order to gain a fuller perspective on it... this takes time and won't come right away, especially for a person in their 20's! sorry, but that is how i see life working... however, young people can sometimes be very perceptive beyond their years..


Yes, strong interest in psychology, especially from a spiritual and esoteric perspective. I have met John on another forum of that type, and he is now looking into Tarot and Astrology. He also likes to hear about the mysteries of ancient cultures.

I will comment on what you shared after we corrected the time of birth below.
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Michael Sternbach



Joined: 01 Mar 2014
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Location: Switzerland

Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 8:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

map wrote:
He might have moved to another country in his childhood. Possible that mother is from another country. He probably has a technical background.


Indeed. He is studying induction motors and stuff like that at school.

Quote:
I do not rule out pilot / teaching & research. He may be pursuing some studies related to international relations. Govt backed foreign service is also possible. This person is really sincere and hardworking but may be someone has to provide the necessary drive. He will be having interest in complex and hidden subjects like religion, occult studies etc.


Again, that's spot on. Besides in occultism, he has always been interested in religion too.

Quote:
He will also have artistic talents but that will not take of significantly.


Currently as a hobby. Will comment on that further in connection with what James has shared.
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Last edited by Michael Sternbach on Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Michael Sternbach



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Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

james_m wrote:
when the ascendant sign and ruler of the ascendant change - that is a big enough change to warrant a very different outlook on the chart in itself... the ascendant ruler is important.. in this case it is now jupiter and it is conjunct the midheaven ruler pluto... this person wants to be, or is a law unto himself and might feel he is above the laws of the ordinary person...


While friendly enough, he is surely a bit of a wild boy! Leery

Quote:
and i think they are probably very ambitious too in a driven career oriented way..


He does take his education seriously. It's probably too early to say much beyond that, given his age.

Quote:
it is hard to know what the work is, but something scorpionic would be an obvious guess with the stellium in scorpio... maybe they could be an artist, or an art dealer if they don't believe in themselves...


He's playing guitar and drums...

Quote:
the reason i say that is the mercury-saturn square is sometimes a signature of someone who doesn't have a lot of confidence in their own thoughts... mercury is in the commanding position to saturn however, so maybe this is not a pronounced feature of this person...


...but complaining about not being able to get his demo tape done!
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Tanit3333



Joined: 12 Jul 2017
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Posted: Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When a birth certificate gives a perfect hour like that, I tend to doubt its accuracy. The house placements are much different in Regio, which is what I use.

Overall, his chart reminds me a lot of a family member's, my nephew, who is a few years younger than me. I wouldn't really call his Mercury self conscious, like someone mentioned. Sag is a pretty bold sign. I know a lot of people in my field (the sciences) with hard Mercury-Saturn and they are often very discriminating people, able to notice details that others miss and can be critical of others. Sometimes they can also even be closed minded. In Sag that is a tad different though and would make him have a more balanced influence there, with both a big picture and minute detail combo, so he could see both sides of things rather than fixate. However, he would likely still be prone towards some of the negative influences of that aspect at times. He probably has firm beliefs and sees himself as open minded but likely doesn't notice that he can be dogmatic, which is probably something he dislikes in others.

He has a lot of influences that suggest self confidence. He has Mars square Jupiter and Pluto, and Jupiter in Scorpio ruling the chart with a sextile to Uranus in the ffirst. Again, I have a nephew with a similar influence. He has Scorpio rising with Jupiter in Sag conjunct Uranus and he prides himself on his originality, and has a take me or leave me sort of personality. He has loads of friends. He can be quite dogmatic. He does not like the conventional in general, and he has the typical Jupterian gregariousness and love of people. He jokes constantly also - I would guess this guy has an excellent humor as well. With his Mars to Jupiter/Pluto influence he could also have some leadership potential, probably more so when he gets older. He does seems to have some drive in his chart, but at the same time when I look at everything, he seems more prone towards wandering a bit. He would probably not do well in conventional education, with Mercury in Sag and so much Uranus going on. He would probably rather study more free-thinking concepts, but I can understand an interest in things like mechanics (my nephew is also good at this). My nephew enjoys philosophy, poetry, the arts in general, and a little bit about special interests, such as studying laws that have to do with marijuana (a special interest of his). He is terrible at math and science and anything that follows set rules that he thinks are pointless or he doesn't care about. I tried to teach him the piano once, but he had no patience for it - does this guy read music or did he learn by ear, I wonder? I would predict by ear. My nephew taught himself the harmonica by ear. Does he play hard rock/ heavy metal with so much Scorpio/8th going on?

With Mars in the 8th square Pluto, he likely is a bit unlucky when it comes to accidents and possibly criminal activity, such as being robbed or physically abused. My nephew is also quite accident prone and was even run over by car when he was a child.

My guess is he has a bit of a feminine side with Venus conjunct Moon on the MC and since the MC deals a lot with our public persona and how the world sees us, he could be easy for women to get along with and gravitate towards. He may also work with a lot of women, such as be in a band with women and may meet romantic interests through his work. He likely would be attracted to dark haired women who are Scorpionic and they may even be a lot like his own mother, with such emphasis on the 10th. Is his relationship with his mom and women in general a tough spot though with Venus in detriment, oriental and in a day chart? I have the same placement but in Aries. I am not close to my mother, and she also has Venus in detriment (in Scorpio) and was not close to her own mother in turn. In his case, the Moon is there too though so he does seem close to his mom but it might be a difficult relationship, such as his mother being emotionally difficult. For a male, they are often more attracted to women who are more forceful and may like stronger females, such as those who ask him out or who challenge him, with Venus oriental in a day chart (this also would emphasize a non conventional approach to anything Venusian, including his music). I often think of heterosexual men with Mars in Leo, especially a Sag male with so much Pluto, as women-chasers (or obviously male chasers if gay or bi) who have a high sex drive, but he would probably still be able to have long term relationships with Venus trine Saturn and so many fixed indicators.

With Jupiter occiental in Scorpio, he is probably not as tall as some Jupterian people and may be a little chubby, with dark features, maybe some slight balding at the forehead, and an attractive face (although with Uranus in the 1st he probably alters his appearance to express his personality outwardly). In general, he has more phlegmatic influences, so excess weight can be an issue, as well as lower energy (although he has choleric influences that help).
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Michael Sternbach



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Posted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Subsequent to Tanit's very elaborate analysis, I asked John to chime in personally. Here you have his comments:

   
Quote:
Overall, his chart reminds me a lot of a family member's, my nephew, who is a few years younger than me. I wouldn't really call his Mercury self conscious, like someone mentioned. Sag is a pretty bold sign. I know a lot of people in my field (the sciences) with hard Mercury-Saturn and they are often very discriminating people, able to notice details that others miss and can be critical of others. Sometimes they can also even be closed minded. In Sag that is a tad different though and would make him have a more balanced influence there, with both a big picture and minute detail combo, so he could see both sides of things rather than fixate. However, he would likely still be prone towards some of the negative influences of that aspect at times. He probably has firm beliefs and sees himself as open minded but likely doesn't notice that he can be dogmatic, which is probably something he dislikes in others.


Yes, a lot of truth in that. I perceive the micro and macro at the same time rather often. However that leaves me very indecisive at times.

Quote:
He has a lot of influences that suggest self confidence. He has Mars square Jupiter and Pluto, and Jupiter in Scorpio ruling the chart with a sextile to Uranus in the ffirst. Again, I have a nephew with a similar influence. He has Scorpio rising with Jupiter in Sag conjunct Uranus and he prides himself on his originality, and has a take me or leave me sort of personality. He has loads of friends. He can be quite dogmatic. He does not like the conventional in general, and he has the typical Jupterian gregariousness and love of people.


Yeah I tend to exaggerate my style and pursue avant garde type of attitude. Difference being, I take people’s opinions about me too seriously.

Quote:
With his Mars to Jupiter/Pluto influence he could also have some leadership potential, probably more so when he gets older. He does seems to have some drive in his chart, but at the same time when I look at everything, he seems more prone towards wandering a bit.


Again, very much in place. In band situation, which I consider my “field”, or profession, I am most often the undisputed leader(trying to not be a control freak!). Drive is a real issue nowadays, I seem to be lacking purpose, or an anchor. Home, if you will.

Quote:
    does this guy read music or did he learn by ear, I wonder? I would predict by ear. My nephew taught himself the harmonica by ear. Does he play hard rock/ heavy metal with so much Scorpio/8th going on?


Mostly by ear. I also learned a lot of theory on my own. Self taught in general. And I don’t know how the hell you figured out the heavy metal part but you couldn’t be more right. Since early on, and to this day, it’s a major passion. That may actually be most accurate thing so far! Congratulations.

Quote:
My guess is he has a bit of a feminine side with Venus conjunct Moon on the MC and since the MC deals a lot with our public persona and how the world sees us, he could be easy for women to get along with and gravitate towards. He may also work with a lot of women, such as be in a band with women and may meet romantic interests through his work. He likely would be attracted to dark haired women


What can I say. You read me like a book.

Quote:
he does seem close to his mom but it might be a difficult relationship, such as his mother being emotionally difficult. Exactly that.

For a male, they are often more attracted to women who are more forceful and may like stronger females, such as those who ask him out or who challenge him, with Venus oriental in a day chart (this also would emphasize a non conventional approach to anything Venusian, including his music). I often think of heterosexual men with Mars in Leo, especially a Sag male with so much Pluto, as women-chasers (or obviously male chasers if gay or bi) who have a high sex drive, but he would probably still be able to have long term relationships with Venus trine Saturn and so many fixed indicators.


Yes yes yes

Quote:
   With Jupiter occiental in Scorpio, he is probably not as tall as some Jupterian people and may be a little chubby, with dark features, maybe some slight balding at the forehead, and an attractive face (although with Uranus in the 1st he probably alters his appearance to express his personality outwardly). In general, he has more phlegmatic influences, so excess weight can be an issue, as well as lower energy (although he has choleric influences that help).


Maybe when I get older. Who knows. So far I’m lean Very Happy


I’d like to take a chance and express my gratefulness to everyone, especially James and Tanit for such a deep reading! They were very good at pointing out the things that stand out the most in me I think.
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