Another comment by Arvind's seeking to identify Stopes specific field was again a bullseye:

Saturn in the 8th, metals or ores, coal or oil and Mars brings chemical, or engineering to the mix

Stopes was both a paleo botanist focusing on ancient extinct plants. In particular she was an International authority on the formation of coal. I suppose once you had exclusively decided she was a scientist and rejected all other possibilities this became easier to arrive at. But its still quite a feat considering all the alternative significations for Saturn you could have used.

Once again please accept my apology for literally disappearing off the forum the way I did over the last few months. I am afraid some things just had to top this forum. Indeed I have been off Facebook and email for the last few months too.

It is self evident there are numerous insightful delineations here. I would suggest these are a great testament for the power of astrology. Still I suppose the sceptics could always argue it only takes 5 minutes of googling and some astrology software to find the identity of a well known mystery chart person like this. It would be interesting to put gifted astrologers like many of the posters here in a hermetically sealed environment to hopefully see if we could replicate such spot on delineations.

Failing that I suppose the best challenge would be to put up chart data not on Astrodatbank or quite so prominent. Stopes chart is hardly obscure and appears in the Clifford data files on Solar Fire. Selecting more obscure individuals with no Wikipedia profile would be another way to go.

A different approach might be to set the challenge of identifying key times in a nativity of less famous individuals although accessing such information is not straightforward.

Mark[/quote]

In another mystery chart thread,someone inferred that you might be cheating,and you were outraged that anyone could suggest that. Now you make the same claim about others. Double standards?

tt - your comment is devoid of astro and adds nothing to the conversation.. no wonder folks are discouraged to bother visiting here... is that your intent? do some astrology and you would get some respect from me.. this ain't it..

TT wrote:

In another mystery chart thread,someone inferred that you might be cheating,and you were outraged that anyone could suggest that. Now you make the same claim about others. Double standards?

No. I never made a crude accusation like that about Arvind. My query was more motivated by the fact that unlike the other posters on this thread I found it impossible at times to follow the actual process involved by that poster. So I simply asked the poster to throw us a few bones on what led them to their spot on conclusions. S/he came back implying that this question just showed the paucity of my astrology skills. Well maybe that is true. I guess I just get irritated by astrologers that like to make terse, gnomic like answers and hold back on how they got there. Surely the whole point of a forum like this is to share ideas and techniques with the wider astrological community? That is why I get frustrated by people that like to make drive by delineations and then pull up the rope up behind him. Contrast that with comments by astrologers like say Wade Caves here. His posts were detailed and very informative and fully shared the process of how he reached his conclusions.

Regarding who is cheating and who is not we are are probably all open to that accusation by sceptics since the parameters of this kind of exercise make it too easy. Hence my comment about changing how we do this in future if we actually want to make it a real test of astrological skill.

However, I agree with James. Continuing this dead thread is rather a waste of time unless anyone has any astrology to contribute.

Mark

Mark wrote: Let me be clear I am not accusing anyone of cheating here! But the option is always there and can never be conclusively eliminated unless you lock your astrologers into a secure underground facility with no internet or mobile access! The other alternative is to use data from people who are not celebrities and who cannot be googled on Wikipedia and/or Astrodatabank. Using clients can be difficult too though due to the confidentiality and consent issues. I have been thinking of putting up a family member who has agreed to this.

I don't really get involved in these mystery chart discussions for a variety of reasons, but I agree with you about the difficulty of using charts which can be discovered with enough patience by narrowing down the planetary positions, as well as the problem of using clients' charts. A family member or friend would be really interesting.

Would people be game if I posted a friend or family member who isn't famous? I guess part of the appeal is to research the person afterwards though.

Paul wrote:

Would people be game if I posted a friend or family member who isn't famous? I guess part of the appeal is to research the person afterwards though.

Yes that is was I suggested before. I certainly remember James and Tanit showing interest in the idea. I had planned to put one of the charts up by now. Unfortunately, I dont have much time for astrology at present so if you want to run with your family member first please go for it! It would help if the birth times were AA or A.

Mark

paul - as mark states, i would be into that.. i have been unusually busy with coming back from a holiday and work since getting back.. i have drifted away from posting here at skyscript, mostly due a combo of these factors.. i hope we can continue and stay on a positive track.. thanks..

I would be willing to post a mystery chart but there doesn't seem to be much interest in the forums lately, probably because most of the regular astrologers that used to frequent no longer visit.

Paul wrote:

Mark wrote: Let me be clear I am not accusing anyone of cheating here! But the option is always there and can never be conclusively eliminated unless you lock your astrologers into a secure underground facility with no internet or mobile access! The other alternative is to use data from people who are not celebrities and who cannot be googled on Wikipedia and/or Astrodatabank. Using clients can be difficult too though due to the confidentiality and consent issues. I have been thinking of putting up a family member who has agreed to this.

I don't really get involved in these mystery chart discussions for a variety of reasons, but I agree with you about the difficulty of using charts which can be discovered with enough patience by narrowing down the planetary positions, as well as the problem of using clients' charts. A family member or friend would be really interesting.

Would people be game if I posted a friend or family member who isn't famous? I guess part of the appeal is to research the person afterwards though.

But of course.